Litsy

Started this in June #kristinl with @Lcsmcat

I just loved it -although Kristin frustrated me- the prose is absolutely beautiful! #12booksof2021

Lcsmcat Her sense of place was so well developed, it made me want to travel to Norway! 2y

Andrew65 Sounds great. 2y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat SAME! 2y

Suet624 Just a really great book. I‘ve read it twice and every time I see a post about it I want to read it again. 2y

kspenmoll Gorgeous edition. 2y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

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I can‘t talk about one without talking about all three, and warning, this will probably go long. After I finished the 3rd book, I read other people‘s thoughts to help me articulate my own. Of the many reviews, blog posts, YouTube videos about this book, the majority were from a Catholic (and one LDS) viewpoint, treating this trilogy as a cautionary tale against sin, specifically sexual sin. Had I read those before I read the books 👇🏻

Lcsmcat 👆🏻I wouldn‘t have read them. They are first of all so much more than that. But secondly, adultery wasn‘t a sexual sin in the 14th century, it was a property crime. Women were the property of their father, and then their husband. Sex outside of marriage was a property crime against the man. But I digress. Kristin is willful, or she follows her heart - pick your adjective- and in the end it doesn‘t make her content. She has moments of passion, 3y

Lcsmcat and moments of despair. And she is a fully formed three dimensional human, living in the constraints of her own time. Undset writes beautiful descriptions of the landscape and searching depictions of the human interior life. There are no cardboard cutout saints or sinners. Lavrans comes close, but even he is shown as a full human, just seen through the eyes of a daughter who adores him. K annoyed me with her bad decisions, and Erlend drove me 3y

Lcsmcat crazy with his clueless immaturity, but they live in my mind as real people, and that, to me, means the author succeeded. Thanks for joining me on this journey @TheBookHippie ! I look forward to your thoughts on this last section, and the book as a whole! #kristinl 3y

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Crazeedi Great review and thoughts. I have these books on my kindle, I must read 3y

vivastory I have been meaning to read this for years, but have been a bit intimidated by the length. Thanks for the thoughtful & honest review. When I finally decide to tackle it I think I will also look for a 3 volume set, rather than a bind up 3y

Lcsmcat @vivastory It was definitely good to have the separate volumes! And we took out time, reading 3-4 chapters per week. (We started in June.) I really appreciated the Tina Nunnally translation, although, full disclosure, I haven‘t read the Archer. (edited) 3y

Lcsmcat @Crazeedi This would be good to read on Kindle - much easier on the hands! 3y

vivastory Thanks! Will definitely note this down for future reference. I have the Penguin Classic Deluxe edition, but it's so unwieldy 3y

TheBookHippie I‘ve read no reviews now I‘m going to do that!!! Only thing I knew was one person wrote on IG they DNF due to the religiosity was too much. 3y

TheBookHippie Here‘s my short IG review I‘ve been posting all along but this is today as I read the last chapter https://www.instagram.com/p/CVGK3A3LuOs/?utm_medium=copy_link 3y

TheBookHippie @Crazeedi You would very much like this read. 3y

TheBookHippie @vivastory that‘s what I used and I loved it! 3y

TheBookHippie Had I read that I would not have read it either 😂. The characters are so whole and the prose so gorgeous I got lost everytime I picked the book up. I was so hoping for peace for Kristin. I think she got mind shifts and slivers of how her life truly was towards the end. I like how she realises the truth of Erlend and that God KNEW and loved him all along. (How I read it) Hopefully that gave her peace. 3y

TheBookHippie Regret and bitterness are awful things. I think that is shown here how it can encompass your vision and truth. 3y

TheBookHippie I imagine people come away from this book with different things that resonated with them. I think if I had read this earlier in my adult life I‘d have come away from it with different thoughts than now and a reread later would do the same. Lots of layers in all the stories told. 3y

Lindy @Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I read this 20 years ago, when I was in my 40s, and I retain a vivid impression of the setting—cold, mud—as well as my overall impression of the message: life is hard and then you die. 🙃 3y

TheBookHippie @Lindy I was taught that at parochial school 😝 3y

Lindy @vivastory I read it in one massive volume that had to remain propped on my kitchen table during the whole time I was reading it because I happened to have carpal tunnel syndrome in my wrists then. 3y

Crazeedi @TheBookHippie that's really good to know, thank you! 3y

Crazeedi @Lindy oh wow what a memory! 3y

Crazeedi @Lcsmcat it's the 3 volumes too so that's why I got! 3y

Lcsmcat @Lindy I would have had to do the same! Arthritis, not carpal tunnel, but huge books are harder now. 3y

vivastory @Lindy The things that we do for books! 3y

Lcsmcat @Lindy “life is hard . . .” We talked earlier about the beauty that Kristin missed because she was so focused on her bitterness/guilt! 3y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

I found this meme on Tumblr and couldn‘t resist, even though it doesn‘t reflect this section of the book. I‘m circling around two themes this time. 1. Was Gaute‘s manner of finding a bride supposed to be a judgment on Kristin? Or Erlend? Or was it meant to help her get over herself? Continuing to feel guilt over a sin you‘ve been forgiven for is after all a form of pride. “I‘m so bad, not even God can forgive me.” (2 in the comments.) #kristinl

TheBookHippie

Lcsmcat Second is a long quote from the end of Chapter 1, which evokes a mood but also poses a question to my mind. 👇🏻 3y

Lcsmcat Now, whenever she took the old path home past the site of the smithy - and by now it was almost overgrown, with tufts of yellow bedstraw, bluebells, and sweet peas spilling over the borders of the lush meadow- it seemed almost as if she were looking at a picture of her own life: the weather-beaten, soit-covered old hearth that would never again be lit by a fire. 3y

Lcsmcat The quote goes on from there, but the image is beautiful abundance springing from the source of disaster. Yet Kristin seems to focus on the disaster, and miss the beauty. It made me sad. 3y

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TheBookHippie She makes me so mad 😡! Why is everything in essence back to that one act?! Having to live a life personally like that - Being judged for how I was at age 15-17- THEY use it for me, but I certainly don‘t. I think that‘s what so infuriating for me. She can‘t control others but she has chosen to live so bitter. Her bitterness seeps literally everywhere around her. I get the religiousity but seriously she‘s sinning WORSE THIS WAY. In my opinion. GAH. 3y

TheBookHippie I do not get what she‘s trying to accomplish with Gaute 🤷🏻‍♀️ she‘s so self involved it really just astounds me. All of the tragedy isn‘t solely affecting her. How can she not see that? How can she not see beauty in the ashes ?! She is choosing this life she is living. It is CHOICE. Her choices that have made her life. Own your sh*t and leave it ! 😂🤣 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat and yes it makes me very sad. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I can‘t decide whether Kristin was unaware of Gaute‘s character, and he was never like Lavrans, or whether he had Lavrans‘ character, but slipped this one time. And the wife he chose. Wow. I don‘t have a good feeling about her. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I so agree with you!!! 3y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

Sorry @TheBookHippie I was driving home from vacation and spaced on posting about this week‘s section.I‘ll get it up tomorrow.#kristinl

TheBookHippie 😂😂 XC meet 4am to 8pm today 😫😳 so no worries ♥️ 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Oh my! I had one who tried XC for a couple years, but he never had to start at 4am! 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat had to ride to other side of the state 😫 3y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

(Pic is of a recreation of Jørundgård for the shooting of a movie version.) This section made me think of a line from a Weird Al song “I‘ll have to get medieval on your hiney.” Everyone piles on Kristin, her boys act the way teenage boys raised by a man who‘d rather fight than farm would act, and Erlend comes back too late, and dies the way he lived - arrow to the groin. K is still being immature, nursing her own grief and pushing aside ??

Lcsmcat 👆🏻 her grieving sons. So much of this book is “too little, too late.” Will K ever find peace? #kristinl @TheBookHippie 3y

TheBookHippie Cut off your nose to spite your face, forest for the trees, can lead a horse to water can‘t make him drink… all things I‘ve thought of while reading. She is very self involved. She needs to forgive herself. I wonder is it her or her religion or her interpretation of her religion or was she just worshipped too much as a child 🤷🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️ I‘m losing hope. She seems unable to move forward or learn from any number of mistakes… frustrating. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Knowing that Undset was a convert to Catholicism, and her own unhappy relationship status, makes me wonder if her overarching theme is “only God can make you happy. Forget earthly joy.” 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat Gads I hope not what an awful way to live. Could be. How unfortunate. 3y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

So much loss in this section! There‘s a hint of a hope of reconciliation and then Simon dies. Points to ponder: Did Simon do the right thing in keeping his secret from K? For himself or for her? Why did the priest chastise K. when it was E who ran off in a snit? Why can‘t K & E talk to each other after 15 years and 7 sons? When E showed up at the bridge should he have expected a public reunion & once again, run off when he didn‘t get it? #kristinl

TheBookHippie

Lcsmcat Photo from a Norwegian language web page which seemed to be about a play version of Kristin, but the photo was clearly Simon Darre. 🤷🏻‍♀️ 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat looks close to what I picture in my mind 😫 3y

TheBookHippie I‘m just at a loss. Did she just shut down as soon as she realized she was pregnant before they married and never forgave herself let alone E? Is she selfish, bitter … I just am at a loss on K. You‘d think she‘d just be with E and settle in but I don‘t think she did. At this part of reading I think I like E the best 🤷🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️ it is just mind boggling … was she pampered too much as a child? Did she then need that in a mate? It‘s perplexing! 3y

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TheBookHippie As for Simon I‘m not sure yet. Would it have mattered is what I wrestle with. 3y

TheBookHippie I have to say I read, think about it, read, think something else, read, unsure of it all! It‘s definitely epic in the spans of human character. 3y

Lcsmcat I find K very bitter. And I think she‘s not helping herself or her kids by hanging on to that! @TheBookHippie (edited) 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Simon‘s not telling her felt to me like honorable behavior as portrayed in 1940‘s movies. 😀 But the “advice” (lecture?) he gave her as he was dying, not so much. (edited) 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I keep hoping for some sort of learning, character changing epiphany for K, but I‘m starting to lose hope. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I‘m losing hope as well!!!!! Simon I just 😝 just when I think oh he‘s okay … he opens his mouth 😂 Bitter is such an all encompassing emotion. I hope she gets past it. How very sad. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Oh I do not like E. the best. He‘s such a child! He runs off in the middle of the night, no discussion, she‘s just supposed to figure it out. Then, when he comes back during a natural disaster to save the day, he gets upset that she doesn‘t run to make up with him in front of everyone in the district. And just takes off again! He and K are both unreasonable, but she‘s more mature in her bitterness than he is in his flightiness. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I just imagined he is still himself -who he‘s always been, warts and all. She is not the child in the forest I fell in love with. 😫 both so immature . 3y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

Simon turns out to be a bit more impulsive and violent than we had been lead to believe. (Internet photo. I had a hard time finding an image for this week‘s section!) Erland seems to have stepped back into his comfort zone, but Simon has left his. And where does that leave the family? Kristin starting to get cut off from her sister: Simon estranged from his brothers. And for what? Because they didn‘t tell him they were involved in the plot, or👇🏻

Lcsmcat 👆🏻 because they didn‘t come forward to defend Erland? And what about Gaute? Was he wrong, or was that too big a secret to give to a 10 year old? #kristinl @TheBookHippie 3y

TheBookHippie I never liked Simon but 😳 I just no words and gah that baby is only ten 😫 I just finished reading last night and I‘m STILLLLL processing …what‘s to happen now?! I‘m amazed at the scope of this story. Is this normal life then you think ?! So much betrayal. Alas though look at today… 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I‘m not sure if it‘s supposed to be “normal life” or not, but it makes me glad to live in my century even with all its faults. 3y

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Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie And I didn‘t like Simon in book 1, but was starting to really respect him before this nonsense. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I‘m still floored!! I‘m so glad to live in this century although most days I think people would prefer women live in the 14 hundreds 🤦🏻‍♀️ 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie True that. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I still find myself entranced in the reading loving of the language but at the same time mortified!!! This is going to be a life favorite I think. 3y

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Lcsmcat

Kristin Lavransdatter, III: The Cross | Sigrid Undset

Kristin start this volume by going to the mountain pastures, although that “wasn‘t done.” And ends it by practicing some kind of witchcraft/pagan magic. She‘s not as happy to be “home” as she thought she would, because she‘s not a child and Erland isn‘t Lavrans. But I‘m seeing a pattern of K always thinking that what she had is better than what she has. Almost even to the point of Simon v. Errand. Thoughts? #kristinl @TheBookHippie

TheBookHippie I think her guilt is overwhelming her and the regret of the consequences of her actions- but not of her actions. I think she is still in love with her husband -however this part has reminded me of the Wallis Simpson quote “You have no idea how hard it is to live out a great romance. I hate this place. I shall hate it to my grave.” My feelings are that she never loved Simon and I don‘t think she has any regret about him. 🤷🏻‍♀️ 3y

TheBookHippie The spell or whatever was 🤯😱 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I agree that she never loved Simon, but I get the feeling that she is comparing the two men. 3y

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TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I thought it interesting she wishes better for her sister. I was thinking Simon to be the son her father never got to have. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Simon is definitely being seen as Lavrans‘ son, by lots of people. And don‘t you think she wishes she had a closer relationship to her sister? 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat she doesn‘t seem to know her sister due to age gap, but seems she loves her a great deal. I hope they can get close. I‘m not sure what she wants, other than I think she wishes she had a daughter. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat Have you read any of her other books? I‘m adding them to my TBR. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie This is my first Undset, but I think it won‘t be my last. She reminds me of Cather, whom she knew, and I love that kind of prose. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I can see that similarity ! I‘m definitely going to read more of her. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat The prose is so soothing. 3y

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TheBookHippie

Kristin Lavransdatter: (penguin Classics Deluxe Edition) | Sigrid Undset

Ack I may cry when this book is done, I love it so.

Currently worried for #kristinl

Lcsmcat

TheBookHippie Also zooming again 😫😫make it stop 3y

Lcsmcat Very worried for Kristin!!! And what‘s up with that weird superstition/witchcraft? I may need to do some research. 🧙🏻‍♀️ 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat Right??? I‘m currently listening 😂🤫🙄 to a meeting- but I want to look it all up I‘m remembering some folklore from #foodandlit I‘m hoping to get through our section then look up things!!! (edited) 3y

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Lcsmcat Some minor spoilers here, but I found this amusing in its way while hunting information about the superstitions. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/culture/2020/5/7/21250016/... 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I have to say I had no clue it would be this religious. It is very interesting Kristin's needless struggle and self involvement of being pious but not really. Fascinates me. 3y

Lcsmcat I‘m not surprised, in that the Middle Ages were kind of ruled by the Church in Europe. But I‘m surprised at how many Roman Catholic sites I‘ve found hailing it as almost a guide to life for women. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat That surprises me not - Protestants and Evangelicals where I live would say it isn‘t strict enough 😱😂🤐 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie 😱 3y

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TheBookHippie

Kristin Lavransdatter, II: The Wife | Sigrid Undset

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OHMYWORD LOVE LOVE LOVE

So glad there is Book III #KRISTINL

Lcsmcat

Larkken The flags are many and look so pretty!! 3y

TheBookHippie @Larkken my chunksters generally end up looking this way. So much to think about in the text with this read. 3y

Lcsmcat I‘m glad for book 3 too. There‘s way too much unsettled!!! 3y

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TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I have soooo many questions !!!! What the world ! 3y

Lcsmcat Knowing the title of Book 3, I really thought Zetland was going to be executed for treason. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat MEEE TOO!! I was holding my breath for it to happen! Just WOW. What a journey! The feelings of Simon as well, WOW. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Simon‘s feelings didn‘t surprise me - still waters run deep - but I was surprised he let them slip in front of Erland. I have to confess that I can‘t remember what the scandal was between Sir Erling and Halfrid that made Sir E change his mind. Do you? And was it stated or implied? (edited) 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I searched for it and found this on GOODREADS.Erling and Halfrid maybe were lovers when Halfrid was married to the abusive first husband. Simon implies Erling could have saved her and to atone for not saving her, Erling should help Kristin. Erling basically says, “look dude, that was a long time ago, and Halfrid committing adultery and running off would not have helped her and besides Kristin is no saint.” (edited) 3y

TheBookHippie Simon is then embarrassed he brought it up and realizes it was dishonorable to try to shame the nobleman by trying to manipulate him based on his past, especially when he‘s kind of right about Kristin. That‘s my read, though it is kind of convoluted. But Simon has very convoluted and precious ideas about what‘s proper and what isn‘t.....@Lscmcat part 2 of the answer I found 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I think it‘s all implied. I was going to go back and reread. 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I got Simon‘s embarrassment, I jut couldn‘t remember the scandal. The whole business with him helping her and almost ignoring his newborn was painful. And Kristin, who seems happiest about motherhood over any other aspect of her life, to leave her kids behind, even an unweaned baby, was unbelievable. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat Her move I got, she loves her husband above all else, beyond even her control I think. His I understand: he loves her, I think he can‘t help hisself either -however, that doesn‘t make either thing wrong actually or right, I‘m thinking this was the authors personal dilemma too. It reads really personal. AND it‘s all believable to me 😱. There‘s an old story my grandma told ⬇️ 3y

TheBookHippie I was reminded of in this section. Two women were walking and asked if you had to chose between your husband and your baby who would you pick. The one lady said my baby and I‘d get a new husband the other said my husband I‘d make a new baby. Which is right? 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I do think Kristin feels guilty over her words and realised oh wait I really love my husband I was cruel. And wants another chance. 🤷🏻‍♀️ 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie Yes, I sometimes think Kristin is nothing but guilt. 😆 It does seem really personal. I agree. I don‘t believe in the concept of “can‘t help himself,” for what it‘s worth. Especially when it comes to infidelity. If it‘s possible to live a celibate life, which it is, then nothing your spouse does makes you have to commit adultery. So Erland did kind of set himself up for what happened. Not that he deserved torture or execution. 3y

Lcsmcat But he didn‘t deserve to get off Scott free. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat Yes, infidelity is definitely a choice and only the fault of the two involved. I think some people are weaker than others in that regard.. My daughters Art History prof was a nun, I remember her sex talks -they were mind bending, she was very intune with her decision to be celibate and why. She would like this read I‘m thinking. I can argue for and against if love is a choice 😂 As for guilt it‘s in Jewish DNA 😂 I‘m well versed. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I‘m thinking he‘ll pay the rest of his life. They both will. 3y

TheBookHippie @Lcsmcat I meant Simon can‘t help loving Kristin. Not her husband cheating 😱 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I think Catholics are very well versed in guilt! 😂 We Episcopalians often say we have all the pageantry without the guilt. 😂 3y

Lcsmcat @TheBookHippie I agree re Simon. Feelings can‘t be controlled, but actions can. I have felt sorry for him since the beginning. Even before she cheated on him, Kristin didn‘t value him. 3y

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