Welcome to Litsy!

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#WorstRead

No surprise here. This was an easy choice. @TheBookHippie 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫

julesG Oh. It's that time of the month. 😁😁 I'll have to find my stinker of the month then. 2mo

Billypar I have to ask about UPP because it's on my TBR. Was it a writing issue, poorly researched, or both? 😬 2mo

Read4life @Billypar it just wasn‘t anything new for me. I had to force myself to pick it up. Due to health circumstances, I‘ve been educated on UPF and this book just didn‘t keep my attention. Others found it interesting and rated it highly. 2mo

48 likes3 comments

Karisa

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

so-so

Pros: Learned of some cool women from the 1920s like Winifred Lenihan, Margaret Leech, and Jane Grant. Always love dissecting books with #SundayBuddyRead 💗

Cons: The author took way too much liberty with these real lives. Too much fiction to be historical fiction for me. Almost slandered Dorothy Parker whose work I love. Disappointing!

61 likes

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

I tried to sleep in 😅🤣🤦🏻‍♀️🤷🏻‍♀️

As for this book. Just write fiction Gill. Don‘t butcher real people‘s lives.

I thank you for the adventure. I still love Dorothy and appreciate how she‘s all through Gilmore Girls.

I thank you for the adventure!!! ♥️♥️😅

Librarybelle It makes me want to read a biography on Parker to learn about the real Parker. Thanks! 2mo

mcctrish It was a fun ride 2mo

IndoorDame I can‘t even with Gill Paul! but this month has seen me pull my Portable Dorthy Parker off the shelf and read from her short stories, which has been awesome! and order a copy of her complete poems because I realized I don‘t have one, eagerly anticipating it‘s arrival. 2mo

See All 20 Comments

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame Me too!! I had to order complete stories. I‘ve been rereading her poems and Portable! (edited) 2mo

TheBookHippie @Librarybelle all of her writing is good. 2mo

vlwelser I cannot even with this book. I finished. I bought the "portable" Dorothy Parker. And I think we're moving on. 2mo

Karisa Oooh, love the Gilmore Girls and buying a copy of Portable Dorothy Parker ASAP! 😊 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser ♥️😅 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa ♥️♥️♥️♥️ 2mo

AmyG I won‘t be reading any more of Gill Paul‘s books. And I, too, still love Dorothy. 2mo

Sargar114 I love the Gilmore Girls! Makes me want to learn more about the real Dorothy Parker! 2mo

Read4life I loved learning more about Dorothy from your links. That was the best part of this buddy read for me. Thank you for sharing. 2mo

slategreyskies I‘m glad this book is over. I didn‘t have much to add to what everyone else said about it. For me, lots of anger at the author. I‘m definitely not reading her again. Ugh. Next month‘s book will be better! ♥️ 2mo

slategreyskies Also, I‘m going to pick up a copy of the Portable as well. 2mo

mollyrotondo I‘m glad I know about these real life women now and can explore who they really were via more reliable and less biased sources. Never reading Gil Paul again. 2mo

tpixie @TheBookHippie despite everyone‘s comments, I‘m going to read this book, review your posts, and learn more about Dorothy Parker! lol and watch Gilmore Girls!! I‘ve been intrigued by your cooking on IG & the Gilmore Girl book list! (edited) 2mo

TheBookHippie @tpixie 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤪😅😵‍💫😵‍💫🤪 I highly recommend reading Dorothy herself as well. Especially her poetry. 2mo

TheBookHippie @tpixie I started watching in 2000 with my daughter and we‘ve never stopped. 24 years later we have changed our minds about events and happenings in the show, once and awhile we say yikes, because of how something was said but that‘s any show decades old. All in all it is a bond and fandom we‘ve never given up. It‘s fun to rewatch and catch things even now after seeing it hundreds of times. 2mo

tpixie @TheBookHippie bonding with your daughter is the best! 2mo

tpixie @TheBookHippie I‘m listening to some of her poems on YouTube 💙 2mo

42 likes20 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Jane
Alec and Harold are albatrosses around Jane‘s neck
Alec does as he pleases
Harold moves to a hotel
Both WTAF moments
She‘s better off without BOTH 😵‍💫

Not sure what to think of it all.

📸ALEC !

Librarybelle I felt so bad for Jane. Here is where a strong woman is considered belittling and emasculating - so terribly awful! Alec and Harold were awful, especially Alec. 2mo

mcctrish I kept thinking Harold was going to be gay. Alec was such an awful person 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish Could have been. He IRL married 2 or 3 more times… 🤷🏻‍♀️ it was definitely said about Alec. 2mo

See All 15 Comments

Karisa Harold moves out and she keeps doing his laundry/bringing him dinner—wtf! Jane started out my favorite character but lost me there when she didn‘t stand her ground against Alec from the get go. I wonder what the real Jane was like… 2mo

AmyG How she put up with Alex for so long….🤷‍♀️….he was vile. I read that Alec was basically in the closet. 2mo

TheBookHippie @AmyG EXACTLY. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa RIGHT? Who does that?! 2mo

Sargar114 @Karisa I wonder that too. She also started out as my favorite and then just made confusing choices. I don‘t know if the author knew what to do with a person like Jane. 2mo

Karisa @Sargar114 Yes! I feel like the real person must have been so awesome—smart NYT reporter in the 1920s, helped launch the New Yorker. . . It felt so wrong for her to just roll over. If she did help him for that long, there must have been more to it 2mo

Read4life I agree both men were horrible. To me, how Paul handled Jane‘s story for the second half especially is another example of the author not knowing how to write historical fiction. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Read4life She has no clue!!! 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa @Sargar114 anything I‘ve read paints her as fiercely independent & intelligent and very even keeled. Only slightly negative thing I‘ve heard is that she was pragmatic -but I think she was probably just logical and didn‘t hold grudges either. 2mo

mollyrotondo I was disappointed that Jane‘s story ended this way. She was the strongest character in this whole book and then to have been weakened due to her annoying husband just didn‘t fit. It‘s like this author wants women to be weak and that strong women need to be knocked down a few pegs 😵‍💫🥴🤯 2mo

Sargar114 @mollyrotondo it definitely feels that way!!! Probably why we‘re all upset about it 😡 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 WE ARE ALLLL so UPSET! 2mo

11 likes15 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Peggy
Dumps the doctor
Thank goodness..
Her book and introducing Dorothy to her publisher was kind
She published another book
She meets her husband
Marries…

I liked her too. Not sure why she was put with an IRL doctor in this book.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Leech

Librarybelle I want to read her novels! It‘s on my list to explore. She grew a lot in this novel. The doctor was a joke…glad she left him! 2mo

mcctrish I liked Peggy a lot, she‘s very modern in her being true to herself - hers is the happiest story, being a good friend, not dumbing herself down, working on her craft, setting goals 2mo

Karisa Wait. So Peggy never dated Alvan either? Gah! It‘s like the author was saying, “So that‘s the reason Peggy Leech‘s books were psychoanalytical. She learned it from a man she was dating…” 🤦🏻‍♀️ Peggy was a character that I thought grew a lot. I‘m curious to read a book of hers too @Librarybelle 2mo

See All 12 Comments

AmyG @Librarybelle I want to read her books too! 2mo

Sargar114 Peggy was a bit confusing to me. I wondered if the author saw herself in Peggy as she wanted the most traditional values of all the women and that might explain why she chose to end the book about DP and her friends with Peggy‘s wedding…trying to make the “happily ever after”. It was quite bizarre to me. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 so bizarre… 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa Nope. 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫 2mo

Karisa @Sargar114 Oh my god! You are so right! Ending it with her wedding to a rich guy was so opposite of what a book about these 4 powerful women should be about… 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa 😵‍💫 2mo

Read4life I know I‘m a broken record but for all the liberty she took in this book it might as well have just been fiction about random people. I agree, @Karisa , that a book (even historical fiction) about these women could have been so much more. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Read4life so much more!!! 2mo

mollyrotondo I didn‘t like Peggy in the beginning but she definitely grew on me. I also want to read one of her books. Couldn‘t stand the author‘s choices and agenda once again but I‘d like to get to know the real Peggy as author 2mo

10 likes12 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Winifred
And Eva
I like them both
IRL Winifred is straight
Eva is not
I like the poem
( At this point I‘m exasperated at the author but 🤷🏻‍♀️)
She quits acting to teach.

I really do like this character and Eva as well. I see there is a Biography on Eva 👀 it may appear in 2025…

Librarybelle I liked Winifred and Eva too. I‘d love to learn more about Eva! 2mo

IndoorDame I‘m genuinely confused about how many of the things she‘s doing that make me angry are done on purpose and how many are done unconsciously. And why an editor didn‘t pull at least SOME of them? 2mo

mcctrish I like both of these characters, I love the little background of how Winnifred leaves performing to directing and the fledgling drama company and their pushback poem and getting funding from the shithead director/producer 2mo

See All 18 Comments

mcctrish If Winnifred is straight irl is this relationship true? 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish She‘s straight and the author made it up 🤦🏻‍♀️ 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame SERIOUSLY!!! 😵‍💫😵‍💫 2mo

mcctrish Why this gay story and not Alec? This is how Winnifred can survive the trauma ? I thought she married ? This is bizarre 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish Winifred IRL married. The author was making it up the rape the lesbian … Eva was and had many famous relationships why put Winifred in it is mind boggling. The author has an agenda. Clearly. She could have written it about Alec. But there would be no agenda 🤷🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️😵‍💫 2mo

Karisa @IndoorDame @TheBookHippie @mcctrish Oh my god! Finding out the author had made so many of Winifred‘s key plot points up was so frustrating🥺🥴😡😵‍💫. Author seems to believe that lesbianism would have been temporary to deal with past rape or to avoid men (like gangsters)… but then WL was straight anyway and never attacked or followed by famous gangsters so… again, why not just give them all fake names then? These events did not happen🥴🤦🏻‍♀️ 2mo

AmyG I did alot of googling and didn‘t realize how “off” ahe was about what actually happened. I can only imagine people read this and think it‘s true. It just really turned me off to this author. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa RIGHT?! WTAF 🤬😵‍💫 2mo

TheBookHippie @AmyG 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫 2mo

mcctrish @Karisa this is so disappointing 2mo

Sargar114 Just smh 🤦🏼‍♀️ I am excited at the prospect of reading about Eva though 2mo

mcctrish 🤦🏻‍♀️ 2mo

Read4life 🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️ So basically she used Dorothy‘s name to get people interested and called it historical fiction but didn‘t stay true to the real people. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Read4life Basically. 2mo

mollyrotondo This author wants to perpetuate damaging tropes and it‘s terrible she used real historical female figures to do that. Looking forward to learning some actual facts about one of these powerful women 2mo

11 likes18 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Dottie
Poor dog.
The “analyst” is worthless😵‍💫
Some friend Elinor is 🤦🏻‍♀️
It was nice everyone visited her in the hospital♥️
Dottie & Winifred friendship, facials and talks are good♥️
Neysa 😵‍💫
Seward 🤷🏻‍♀️
Writes and writes published hit after hit …
Seems to settle .
Or not…
Honestly the authors depiction of Dorothy is what she thinks Dorothy is or⬇️

TheBookHippie ⬆️ what she thinks abortion or suicide is. We‘ve seen none of the real Dorothy or even a character -it‘s like reading a narrative of someone‘s opinion..
And the stuff she left out 🤯
Complex does not equal weak
Puzzling that she wrote good about everyone except Dorothy -who she claims the novel is about.
End of my rant 😵‍💫 2mo

Librarybelle I almost cried over Woodrow Wilson the dog! It‘s thanks to hearing everyone‘s prior knowledge of Dorothy Parker that I can see how limited in scope Parker‘s portrayal is in the book. From my experience, mental health is not a weakness nor is it one that should make the character seem pitiful and undeserving of a good life. 2mo

IndoorDame I‘m really trying not to rant today. But the thing with the dog besides being heartbreaking, baffled me as a writing choice. It seemed like even if you agreed with the author‘s politics, didn‘t see subtext in her depiction of suicide, etc… and know nothing about Dottie, making her character cruel to her pets would betray the author‘s dislike of her blatantly and unnecessarily. 2mo

See All 13 Comments

mcctrish The part with Woodrow Wilson seemed dramatized - obviously there‘d be a record of the dogs death and getting help removing him but could the author dislike DP more? I certainly find her the least likeable character in this story because of how she‘s presented. 2mo

Karisa I agree. “Complex 🚫weak” @TheBookHippie The portrayal of Dorothy and the acknowledgment in the historical notes of what was left out was baffling! I kept thinking why not just give the women all different names and call it historical fiction set in the 20s loosely based on real people. It felt like the book team were acting as vampires banking on Dorothy‘s fame for sales. The author seemed to think she‘d captured DP well too🤦🏻‍♀️ 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame 💯💯💯💯 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫 agree with everything you said. Just mind boggling.. 2mo

AmyG @Karisa Yes…my thoughts exactly. I wasn‘t a fan how Dottie was betrayed. Yes, one author‘s fictional opinion. 2mo

Sargar114 @Karisa that was my thought exactly! I don‘t know much about DP but this absolutely muddied the waters in what I know. It‘s sad that even if these were fictional characters the story wouldn‘t be any more readable. I almost threw the book again when WW died and then she just left him for the hotel to deal with. So awful, I get she‘s dealing with mental health issues and may not have the capacity to deal, but the author deals with it abysmally 2mo

Karisa @AmyG @Sargar114 Exactly! 2mo

mollyrotondo I don‘t know why this book was “about Dorothy Parker” because the author never even talked about Dorothy‘s accomplishment. It was focused entirely on Dorothy‘s flaws and then magnified. I really didn‘t like that the author chose to write about her this way which shows she really had no respect for her. So why write about her at all? 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo The author clearly hates strong women or is seriously intimidated by them? It‘s horrific the way she wrote about everyone! 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo and you‘re correct ZERO respect. 2mo

11 likes13 comments

Sargar114

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

pan

I don‘t know much about Dorothy Parker and it‘s a shame this was my first introduction. Frankly, even if they were fictional characters I don‘t know that I would have cared for this one still. It was a struggle to finish and really dealt with trigger topics such as sexual assault, abortion, and suicide quite poorly. Finished to continue the discussion with #sundaybuddyread which (as usual) was the best thing to come of this.

7 likes

mcctrish

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

pick

#sundaybuddyread that I‘d never heard of 🤷🏻‍♀️ it was a fast and easy read ❤️ Dorothy Parker was my least favourite of the bridge club girls, but she lived her life out loud and I am so glad I read this book

44 likes

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

pan

This could have been great. Such a fantastic group to base a historical novel on but the author really blew it. It was both disappointing and maddening.

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD @TheBookHippie

Alwaysbeenaloverofbooks Oh no 😬 2mo

DebinHawaii Ack! I am so far behind from travel last week & being sick all week this week I haven‘t even checked out the discussion. Now I‘m not sure I want to catch up! 🫣😆 2mo

dabbe #fanofthepan! #betterbooksahead 🤩🤩🤩 2mo

48 likes3 comments

IndoorDame

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

pan

JUST, NO

The first 250 pages, a fun historical fiction story, lots of problematic pieces, but I was happily able to put aside my irritation with the author and enjoy the story for what it was.

Last 250 pages, my irritation redoubled and compounded and I can‘t remember the last time I‘ve finished a book quite this angry at the author.

#sundaybuddyread

52 likes

slategreyskies

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

pan

I wasn‘t sure whether to give this a so-so or a pan. In the end, I‘ve decided to go with a pan. I felt like there were way too many instances where the author‘s opinions were glaringly visible, so much so that the characters themselves disappeared behind the author. I really just did not enjoy the way this book was written, and I feel like it was unfair to these women to be represented in the book this way. ⭐️⭐️!

mollyrotondo 💯💯💯💯 2mo

AmyG I gave it a so-so. I liked some of it. 2mo

TheBookHippie 🎯 2mo

dabbe #fanofthepan! #betterbooksahead 🤩🤩🤩 2mo

IndoorDame Exactly how I felt!!!! 2mo

50 likes1 stack add5 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

In case you didn‘t know Dorothy Parker wrote the original A Star is Born - yes that one- with Alan Campbell and Robert Carson.

🎥 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Star_Is_Born_(1937_film)

Ruthiella Wow! I didn‘t know that. Amazing, because at the core, all four movies are basically the same. The woman outshines her husband. He has other issues that make their life difficult. She is willing to dial back her career for him. He removes himself from the situation and the last scene… 😭😭😭 (edited) 2mo

AmyG No way! I had NO clue. Great movie. It was just on TCM. (edited) 2mo

lil1inblue I remember watching this version, but I had no idea Dorothy Parker wrote it! That's amazing. 2mo

54 likes3 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD FUN

Who owns “Dorothy Parker's
Drank Here” production?

Amy Sherman-Palladino
Amy Sherman-Palladino is the founder of Dorothy Parker Drank Here Productions.
She is known for her trademark rapid-fire dialogue, which is often full of pop culture references, and as well for her preferred master shot filming style.

AKA Gilmore Girls
Dorothy is quote and referenced constantly in the show.

44 likes

Librarybelle

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

so-so

This is a little hard to review. On the surface, this is a good story about female friendships in the 1920s and follows them as they navigate Prohibition, depression, suicidal thoughts, and women‘s reproductive health.

I came to this book with a very basic knowledge of Dorothy Parker and her group of friends. The nuances of the 1920s is fun to read. However, after participating in the #SundayBuddyRead ⬇️⬇️⬇️

Librarybelle ⬆️⬆️⬆️there are flaws. And, maybe characterizations that are not accurate to real life. There is a balance that historical fiction authors should follow to capture the essence of the real life character without completely fabricating the character…dialogues are fine, but completely changing a persona is wrong. It seems this is the case for this book. I liked the story, but feels it has to be a so-so rating. 2mo

17 likes1 comment

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This author is top of the list of I WILL NEVER READ AGAIN #OYTOTHEVEY

See you Sunday #SUNDAYBUDDYREAD 😅😵‍💫🤐🤫

Librarybelle I‘m now a bit apprehensive to read the last bit! Oh boy… 😳 2mo

IMASLOWREADER lol we cant like everything or everyone 2mo

TheBookHippie @Librarybelle 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤷🏻‍♀️ 2mo

See All 17 Comments

vlwelser Well that's ominous 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser I‘m crabby 🤣😅🤷🏻‍♀️ 2mo

vlwelser It's hot 2mo

TheBookHippie @IMASLOWREADER 🤣🤣🤣🤣 TRUTH. Oy. 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser NO AIR in Title one schools 😵‍💫 we raised enough money to get it put in over the summer… I‘ve bought more water bottles and popsicles than one would think possible in 3 days 👀 2mo

vlwelser The AC in our office wasn't ready for it to be 90. One of my friends started our morning convo with "I'm cranky." It was incredibly helpful to start that way. 2mo

vlwelser When he complained later because someone used "amber" as the warning color on a spreadsheet it was much easier to deal with. 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser 🥵🔥 we went from 40s to 90s for three days straight -tomorrow back to 60. 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser 🤣🤣🤣 I‘m cranky 🤣🤣🤣 solidarity 🤣🥵😅 2mo

vlwelser We just received your hot weather. 60 is my preference. 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser Word. 60 is livable. 2mo

IndoorDame For reals! It‘s hot! It‘s apparently going to stay that way all week! And the last quarter of this book totally erased my but I‘m still enjoying the story mindset and just left me mad at this author about something practically every chapter! I‘m a super easy going person, that‘s not actually easy to do! 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame SAME 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫. 2mo

Read4life I‘m with you, @IndoorDame . I was so annoyed during most of this last section. 2mo

47 likes17 comments

DebinHawaii

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

Playing catch up with #SundayBuddyRead over lunch. (Ginger tataki ahi poke & chips). Having a slow day getting over jet lag & getting ready for the week.

slategreyskies I‘m doing the same thing this afternoon, only not with such delicious treats! Enjoy! 2mo

51 likes1 comment

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

I‘m still enjoying this 😂😅🤣

I do think there is more to Dorothy than her flaws.
I think if someone just showed mine -you‘d miss who I was entirely, and I think that‘s my issue here. We are not the sum of our mistakes.

How are you liking it???

Happy Sunday 🩶🩶🩶🩶🩶🩶
We get to finish now!!

IndoorDame I‘m annoyed with the author, and this isn‘t my vision of Dorothy, but I‘m enjoying the story (I guess I‘m a contradiction 😂) 2mo

vlwelser I still like it a lot. Despite my desire to skim the Dottie parts. 2mo

Karisa Totally agree. Enjoying it but wishing she‘d have stayed truer to Dorothy. There‘s enough of a story there without tinkering so much. On a way out there sidenote, I‘m hearing that the new Amy Winehouse movie has similar issues. I guess it even keeps emphasizing that she wanted to be a mom. Had me thinking of this book and Parker… Majorly missing the point, people! 🙄 Do many not know how to deal with powerful, talented, complex women? 2mo

See All 16 Comments

TheBookHippie @Karisa YES. Exactly. THEY DO NOT KNOW what to do. Also Amy I‘ve heard same and don‘t intend to watch. 2mo

AmyG I also like this. I don‘t know anything about Dottie personally and this story gives me me a bad taste for her. But I will always like her work-she is just so smart and witty. 2mo

Read4life I‘m liking it. Thanks to the links you‘ve posted I‘ve learned more about these characters. As a result, I don‘t like the way she‘s portraying Dottie. She‘s missed so many of her achievements and positive points. 2mo

mcctrish I am enjoying it, a wild fast read that certainly makes me feel all the feelings. I‘m in the fence about the AW movie, I do love her music 2mo

Librarybelle I do like this. I came to this book with only an extremely basic knowledge of Parker and her group. This book does paint people in a certain light that seems awful, and I appreciate the extra links to get to know the people better. It is a very tricky line to balance between historical fiction and respectfulness of the subject - I cannot speak about Paul‘s toeing the line, since I have such limited knowledge, so everyone‘s comments are helpful! 2mo

Sargar114 I can‘t get past the flaws of the author. I like reading about these women, but do not like the style in which they‘re portrayed. It‘s disappointing to hear it‘s not true to the women or the time period either. My library hold came up and wasn‘t able to renew so I don‘t know if I‘ll be able to finish anyway, but not terribly upset as it doesn‘t really feel like this story is going anywhere anyway. 2mo

julieclair I am enjoying reading about Dorothy Parker and her crowd, of whom I knew very little. I‘m not pleased with the liberties the author is taking, though. I really appreciate the links, which have helped to give me a more realistic picture. 2mo

mollyrotondo The author‘s viewpoints about women‘s health are bleeding through way too much so it‘s turning me off of the book more and more. I also can‘t stand how Dottie is portrayed and she keeps getting worse instead of growing. I still like Jane and Winifred‘s storylines so I‘m definitely going to finish to see how their lives turn out in the book. Loving our discussion though!!! 2mo

Sargar114 @mollyrotondo AGREED! My hold ended up renewing so I‘ll push through cause the discussion makes it worth it! 2mo

mollyrotondo Yayy!! So happy you‘ll be joining us for the ending!!! 2mo

Sargar114 Also if I finish I can justifiably give it a bad review 🙈😂 (edited) 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 word 😵‍💫 2mo

slategreyskies I‘m enjoying the discussions enough to finish the book, but I definitely would bail on it if it weren‘t for this group. It‘s just so much more fun with all of you! 🤍 2mo

12 likes16 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

TheBookHippie https://artsci.case.edu/dittrick/online-exhibits/history-of-birth-control/contra... 2mo

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Me - the diaphragm is not likely to have been used, especially in this timeline time frame but maybe because it was NYC

The author is playing with the timeline I get it it‘s fiction but it‘s a little too loose for my taste. Or I should stick with not reading historical fiction 🤣

https://www.reproductiveaccess.org/2013/04/a-history-the-diaphragm/
⬇️

TheBookHippie https://getmaude.com/blogs/themaudern/a-brief-history-of-the-diaphragmhickleberr.... 2mo

IndoorDame 😂 somehow I was less surprised that a doctor had access to a diaphragm in NY in the 20s than that he could “pick one up” for a girlfriend without a fitting. I‘d never heard of one size fits all diaphragms, but I learned that there‘s even one back on the market now! 2mo

See All 18 Comments

vlwelser Maybe it's not a diaphragm but some earlier version. And the author simplified this. It seems like it would be better if this got left out. 2mo

Karisa Historical fiction still should be true to the time and in this case also the people. Too many liberties and it just becomes fiction. If fiction, shouldn‘t use real names as it locks in their lives and the dates too. I wonder if the author needed Parker‘s family or estate‘s permission 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa NCAAP hold Dorothy‘s estate. She willed it to MLK jr upon his death it went to NCAAP she was a social justice warrior and actually an abortion rights champion . .. she even called out Hemingway for being a hypocrite 👀🤣 (edited) 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa The 1920s were to be Parker's decade.. She published some 300 poems and free verses in various magazines, and in 1926, her first volume of poetry became a bestseller and garnered positive reviews, despite being dismissed as 'flapper verse' by The New York Times. (edited) 2mo

AmyG @TheBookHippie Very Interesting about Dotties estate. I, too, think the author should make an effort to be true to the time period. 2mo

Karisa @TheBookHippie Whoa! Gill Paul is selling Dorothy Parker so short! Why base it on such a famous and beloved author only to change so much? Irritating! 2mo

TheBookHippie @AmyG Yes. No doubt she was a mess, however she did try to use her mess for good and she reportedly- by several accounts never used her vicious words on innocent ppl in the public, in private could be, but as a whole as a picture of society hindsight sees she was dead accurate. 🤷🏻‍♀️ 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa yup. I think she doesn‘t like her outspokenness and views on abortion. 2mo

mcctrish I was kind of surprised with the diaphragm and my thought was “is he fitting her for it? One stop affair/gyno visit?!” 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish exactly. So odd. 2mo

Librarybelle I had no clue about the history, so thanks for the info! 2mo

Sargar114 I was confused about the diaphragm remark as well. @mcctrish that‘s some talent if he can remember her “size”. I also agree it should be true to the character or time period, which adds to the disappointment of this story. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 RIGHT?! Like what? 2mo

mollyrotondo I didn‘t know the history of diaphragms so thank you for that. I thought it was just odd that this guy would just come right out and declare he is going to pick her up a birth control device without her even asking. I feel like men in general don‘t think like that. I get he‘s a doctor but it was just odd to me. Definitely birth control should be used but maybe ask Peggy first about her preference and have a discussion? He‘s pushy. 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo ALLOFTHIS 😵‍💫 2mo

10 likes18 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

Peggy and the doctor

Alvan Barach https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvan_Barach

https://www.nytimes.com/1977/12/14/archives/dr-alvan-barach-breathing-expert.htm...

Thoughts on this relationship ?????

IndoorDame He doesn‘t seem at all inclined towards marriage, and she doesn‘t seem to care, which is an interesting pivot for her character. 2mo

vlwelser I guess he'll do for a starter boyfriend. She can find a better one later. 2mo

AmyG I don‘t particularly like him. I hope she ditches him. 2mo

See All 6 Comments

Librarybelle He‘s not the greatest…I think he has a hidden agenda. 2mo

Sargar114 It‘s interesting in that it seems to be a pretty modern relationship for how conservative she can be. 2mo

mollyrotondo I don‘t like him. Hopefully she moves on from and doesn‘t become heartbroken by him. 2mo

8 likes6 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

You and I are women who think deeply and uncover profound truths about human nature.

Peggy & Dottie and writing
And supporting each other
Love

Peggy and her book!!! 🎉🎉🎉

https://archive.org/details/backofbook00leec

IndoorDame I love that Peggy got published! And that she‘s using her time checking in on Dottie for them to support each other‘s writing deadlines! 2mo

vlwelser Peggy is a force and I love it. She needs to ditch the bf though. IMO 2mo

Karisa I loved that her book was published too. Thanks for the link @TheBookHippie Totally agree with you @vlwelser Alvan is not the greatest. He should have referred Dorothy to someone else. Boundaries being stepped over is a big 🚩 2mo

See All 11 Comments

AmyG I like Peggy alot. I am happy she got published. Not too aure about her BF, though. 2mo

mcctrish Is it just me or is Alvan going to marry a nice Jewish girl and leave Peggy? I‘m pretty sure he isn‘t what Dottie needs, it feels like he‘s making a case study out of her not actually caring for her. I think Peggy is amazing, she‘s focused on her work and such a good friend and SMART! 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish RIGHT?!?! SAME THOUGHTS. 2mo

Librarybelle Love Peggy! And good point, @mcctrish . I really felt kind he was trying to analyze Peggy to further his psychoanalytical experience. 2mo

Sargar114 @Karisa 💯 @mcctrish good call, you may be right! I do like how forceful of a friend she is to Dottie as she needs that. I like that she‘s not willing to compromise herself for the sake of a man, but I wonder if that changes depending on what happens with this relationship. I worry her tendency/desire for the traditional May win out. 2mo

julieclair @mcctrish Yes! I agree with everything you said. 2mo

mollyrotondo At the beginning of the book I really didn‘t like Peggy because she had this traditional goal of finding a man and getting married. But I like her much more now that I see what a good friend she is to Dottie and she fulfilled her big goal of being published. Really exciting to see her grow more. But I agree that Alvan is not my favorite. I hope she doesn‘t become devastated if he leaves her. 2mo

slategreyskies I like that quote. That section was my favorite part of the book so far and possibly the only section that I highlighted. 2mo

12 likes11 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Oy Elinor…thoughts ?

https://sarahmccoll.substack.com/p/elinor-wylie-narcissists-silver-and

https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poets/elinor-wylie

https://www.literaryladiesguide.com/classic-women-authors-poetry/10-poems-by-eli...

IndoorDame I‘ve only read a few of her poems, but even if she‘s a true genius, there‘s no excuse for the way she acts. You can live for yourself and indulge in debauchery, and flaunt society‘s conventions without being uncaring and careless. 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame Same. She is what the author is portraying Dottie to be and worse. 2mo

vlwelser She's the worst. So selfish in every aspect. 2mo

See All 11 Comments

Karisa Elinor is horrible. Hard to tell if she really was like this. Feels like a caricature of a person… 2mo

AmyG Ooooo I do NOT like her at all. Hey, Elinor….GFY. 2mo

mcctrish She‘s awful. She loves silver and so do I 😬 I do like her poems. I hate how she goaded Dottie into showing her scars. I felt sick to my stomach but Alec and Dottie are not disimilar when they know secrets 2mo

Sargar114 She is unbearable 2mo

Librarybelle Not a fan of Elinor. She‘s a manipulator, or at least as portrayed in this book. 2mo

julieclair If the scar story is true, that‘s all I need to know about Elinor. As sometimes happens with artists/writers, I can appreciate her work while not liking her actions and choices. 2mo

mollyrotondo I really don‘t like Elinor and once agajn we see Dottie in a bad light because Dottie is close friends with her. The scar part was despicable 2mo

slategreyskies I hated her after the scar scene. I really hope the author just made that up. But at the same time, it makes me angry that she‘d write it in the first place, even if it was true. I don‘t think this book should have been written this way. I don‘t like this author at all. 2mo

9 likes11 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Dottie
👀
Men‘s appendages good grief😬

Is writing and has a play that‘s out, but makes no money

Marriage still not right

The authors take on abortion 😵‍💫

I can‘t say this is Dorothy at all.
I don‘t think the author likes her.

ALSO. Abortion is healthcare. Oy.

Miami - sun

A move to the Gonk
-a serviced room-
Perfect

Psychoanalysis …
Drinking

She‘s a bit lost

There IRL is way more writing from her in this time..

IndoorDame I don‘t think the author likes her either. But I did wonder if the author was trying to get us (herself?) to like her better (in a super twisted way) by implying that the abortion drove her to the brink of suicide 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫 Abortion is healthcare!!!! And books with hidden agendas about certain topics, abortion being at the top of that list, make me super angry even when I‘m otherwise enjoying them! 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame Exactly my thoughts. 2mo

AmyG Dottie is swlf-absorbed and can be quite rude. Not a fan. We all have problems. 2mo

See All 12 Comments

vlwelser It does seem like the author pulls out her worst traits. 2mo

Karisa The author is making Dorothy seem pathetic. She really was writing during that time?! What? Why take that away from Dorothy? Feels central to any book trying to capture her 😡 I feel like the author was trying to cater to the right on abortion. . . Not cool 2mo

mcctrish It‘s hard to beloved this a book about Dorthy Parker, more like a roast- I have to say I liked what I knew of DP better before. It seems like the dr saying don‘t drink during analysis sent Dottie over the deep end into alcoholism 2mo

Sargar114 It definitely doesn‘t paint her in a flattering light. I picture more as her struggling with mental health making it hard to read, especially because she is seemingly spiraling without the help of her more stable friends. 2mo

Librarybelle I thought the same thing, @Sargar114 …she‘s struggling with mental health, feels alone, but has no way to say how she feels without sounding horrid. 2mo

Sargar114 @Librarybelle it doesn‘t help that she doesn‘t have a great example of how to react so she just relies on her humor 2mo

Librarybelle @Sargar114 Yes! So sad 2mo

mollyrotondo I hate the way the author is portraying Dorothy. She‘s the least likable and she‘s supposed to be the focus of the book. It also makes no sense to me that she is going for psychoanalysis but not getting any better with her emotional struggles. Whats the point then of the psychoanalysis? 2mo

slategreyskies I feel like the author deliberately writes Dottie to be unlikeable. It makes the book hard to read. I‘m so frustrated with the author that the last thing I want to do is keep reading when it feels like all we‘re getting is the author. The characters don‘t come alive for me, because the author‘s opinions and views and judgments of them get in the way. 2mo

9 likes12 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Jane bobbed her hair

Finds out about Harold‘s debts😳
Goes for a walk ….

I still think Alec & Harold are something to each other
And I loathe them both

JANE got her backers for THE NEW YORKER 🎉 but gets no credit?

Jane and Dottie fight
Is Dottie right even though it was mean and a vicious verbal attack?

Not sure what to think..

Read4life Alec is terrible. He‘s just awful. A truly ugly spirit. Harold seems so weak and not at all the man I picture for Jane. She‘d be better off with both of them out of her life. 2mo

IndoorDame I‘ve come back around to thinking Alec and Harold are actually involved. Also Ive lost all respect for Harold either way. Dottie is clearly the can dish it out but can‘t take it type. I do get why she‘s upset, but at the same time, her calling a dis mean and vicious is a little funny. 2mo

Librarybelle I feel terrible for Jane. It seems like she has no support anywhere. The scene with Dottie was harsh - I could see both sides, but still sad. 2mo

See All 11 Comments

AmyG Oh Alec and Harold…didn‘t think of that. (edited) 2mo

vlwelser I love Jane. Harold is horrible. 2mo

Karisa @Librarybelle Yes! Agreed. Both are hurt and lashing out because they just can‘t give what the other needs at the right time. So sad 2mo

mcctrish Alec is clearly in love with Harold whether it‘s reciprocated or not, Alec loves that he comes between Jane and H. I hate Alec, he‘s toxic and Dottie is too. @IndoorDame I‘d feel bad for Dottie if she wasn‘t such a caustic barb thrower, but it has to go both ways and she can‘t take any heat 2mo

Sargar114 Dottie and Jane don‘t seem very good friends for each other. Dottie isn‘t in a good place mentally and Jane has too much going on to be the kind of friend Dottie needs. They were both correct but the messages are coming across poorly. Alex is still terrible, Harold has a gambling problem and seemingly no ambition but I don‘t see him in a relationship with Alec more than friendship 2mo

Sargar114 Jane is such a bad@SS and should dump the both of them (Alec and Harold) that is 2mo

julieclair Jane is amazing. It totally drives me nuts that Harold gets all the credit. 2mo

mollyrotondo I feel so bad for Jane. She has a husband with a gambling problem and really only thinks about himself (he pitched his ship magazine to the investor instead of the current magazine idea he was actively working on with his wife? 😵‍💫😡😏) and Dottie is a bad friend to Jane. Dottie is portrayed so cruelly in this book. And Alec just needs to get his comeuppance 2mo

10 likes11 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Eva La Gallienne helping Winifred I like it
She seems kind

https://playbill.com/article/the-legacy-of-eva-le-gallienne-com-101290

https://www.berkshiretheatregroup.org/from-the-archive-eva-legallienne/

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Eva-Le-Gallienne

Use reader view https://www.nytimes.com/1991/06/05/obituaries/eva-le-gallienne-actress-is-dead-a...

https://legacyprojectchicago.org/person/eva-le-gallienne

IndoorDame Her character in the book seems very kind. And the historical person seems extremely cool! I‘d love to see more of her! 2mo

Librarybelle I‘d love to learn more about her - thanks for the links! 2mo

AmyG Women helping women 👊🏻 2mo

See All 12 Comments

vlwelser I also quite love this character. She makes an excellent counter to Elinor who only thinks of herself. 2mo

Karisa @vlwelser Good point! Eva and Neysa would‘ve made a good book too. I like that the book is bringing all these cool people back to life for us. Always amazing to see that so many talented people were in the same microcosm. How much did they benefit from each others‘ support and inspiring talents? 2mo

mcctrish @vlwelser me too! Elinor is awful and I agree @Karisa so many cool people coming to life for us 2mo

Sargar114 This is pretty neat. I also wonder if Winifred might not just end up being a lesbian anyway. She doesn‘t seem to be interested in men anyway (understandably). I agree, I love seeing women helping women! 2mo

julieclair What an admirable woman! I had never heard of her. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 yes. She seems to have no interest in men (outside of the assault reason) she‘s written to not really like men in that way. 2mo

Sargar114 @TheBookHippie you made a good point on the other question about this being a trope since the only reason a woman couldn‘t like a man of power is because she‘s a lesbian 🙄 2mo

mollyrotondo I really love her! I had never heard of her. I also agree @vlwelser that she is a great counter to Dottie‘s friend Elinor. Elinor is intolerable but Eva is doing a real solid for Winifred even though she definitely thinks Winifred is crazy after she put them both in danger in the alley. I hope Eva doesn‘t run away after that. 2mo

vlwelser @mollyrotondo I also hope she doesn't run away. 2mo

10 likes12 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Winifred
Teaching
George Bernard Shaw https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Joan_(play)
Joan of Arc
Saint Joan
FAME- it‘s a lot.
UGH the gangster 😵‍💫
Peggy and Jane to the rescue ♥️♥️
She just has to be a lesbian..
Which is fine by her

Winifred and her assault.
What a brave woman.

https://www.rainn.org/

Yay, we get more of Winifred which I rather like. I do like her storyline.

Read4life I‘m enjoying Winifred‘s storyline and I‘m happy we got more of her past even though it was horrible. 2mo

IndoorDame Love her! Love her acting storyline and where it seems to be heading! I have reservations about where her assault storyline seems to be heading, but I‘m trying not to judge the author prematurely… 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame SAME 👀😵‍💫😅 2mo

See All 22 Comments

Librarybelle Me too, @Read4life ! 2mo

AmyG I figured an assault of aome kind happened to her. I like her character alot. 2mo

vlwelser She might be my favorite. She's so fierce. 2mo

Karisa @vlwelser Yes! Jane was my favorite at first, but Winifred is my current. She‘s strong, smart, talented, and kind. @Read4life I‘m glad we got more of her backstory too. @IndoorDame Yes, not completely trusting the author with these stories of real people. It‘s a shame because the author should disappear but I keep thinking about Gill Paul in the background instead of Dorothy Parker and her friends. 2mo

IndoorDame @Karisa well put 2mo

mcctrish I forgot it was Sunday 🤣🤣 #longeeekendvibes there were sweats from me when Winnifred said “first and last time” how brutal but worse is the judgment she is getting when she reacts strongly to men disrespecting her. No means no, back the fuck off! I want a tee shirt or a bracelet or something with WWWD on it ( what would Winnifred do and it would be kick ass) 2mo

Sargar114 @IndoorDame I‘m judging the author; she used the phrase “let him rape her” and I really almost threw the phone across the room. Under no circumstance should a victim be portrayed as letting it happen to her. I get she was frozen in fear but that was by no means her fault. This was a brutal scene anyway and that made it 1000 times worse. 2mo

IndoorDame @Sargar114 thanks for pointing that out. That‘s one of those really insidious, damaging phrases. And it‘s one women of my generation were trained not to hone in on as much as we should. 2mo

julieclair @Sargar114 Absolutely! There is no “letting him” in rape. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 YUP. And the only way out is to be a lesbian because you were raped is an old troupe as well. @IndoorDame 2mo

Sargar114 @TheBookHippie @IndoorDame @julieclair it‘s so upsetting!!! 2mo

IndoorDame @TheBookHippie it‘s my least favorite lesbian stereotype! It‘s not one I‘ve had to deal with personally since the 90s, but I‘m guessing it‘s still out there in conservative circles and if the author takes us there in a more concrete way I‘ll be really upset at her for reinforcing that in the world 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame EXACTLY MY FEAR. Shes going on my NO NO author list … 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 honestly if not for us reading I‘d have skimmed & bailed but … here we are, hopefully learning something. Oy. 2mo

mollyrotondo @Sargar114 this was yet another moment in the book that I stopped and questioned the intention of the author. No one lets themselves be raped. I was really angry that this author would write such a statement. I could understand it more if Winifred was saying this to herself because she was beating herself up over it but the author used it in the third person narrator so I went 🤯 @TheBookHippie glad you are banning this author. Too many 🚩 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo it‘s 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫 she‘s writing a book about what she thinks of these people and their lives. Not the actual people. 2mo

mollyrotondo @TheBookHippie yes!!! That‘s exactly what‘s going on. I just haven‘t been able to understand why she‘s portraying Dorothy Parker so badly but yeah she‘s writing about what she thinks of Dorothy and the rest of them. It‘s 😬 2mo

slategreyskies I‘ve only just caught up with this past Sunday‘s section of the book, and I‘m glad to hear that I‘m not the only one who has a problem with this author. I too would no longer be reading if it wasn‘t for these discussions and all of you. I don‘t like the way that the author writes these characters with what feels like judgment. And the way the rape was written really pissed me off. As someone who‘s been raped, that sort of writing is a hard no. 2mo

TheBookHippie @slategreyskies Agree and me too as a survivor is a hard no. 2mo

10 likes22 comments

Scandalous Women: A Novel of Jackie Collins and Jacqueline Susann

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

My Bubbe Grandma in the years we are reading about ♥️

See you Sunday #SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

tpixie Adorable 🥰 2mo

slategreyskies I love this pic! 🥰 2mo

IndoorDame Gorgeous photo!!! 2mo

See All 11 Comments

RowReads1 She‘s lovely! 2mo

LeahBergen She‘s so pretty! 2mo

Avanders Wow! So cool! 🤩 2mo

dabbe Cowabunga! Those eyes are mesmerizing! 💙🩵💙 2mo

TheBookHippie @dabbe We all have them. 💙💙 2mo

vlwelser Did you see this? If only it was Danielle Steel.

2mo

dabbe @TheBookHippie 💙💙💙 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser I DID 👀 I actually had the same thoughts 🤣🤣🤣 2mo

73 likes11 comments

BarkingMadRead

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

Reading at the airport 😍 finishing this today!

Bookwormjillk Did you have a spoon malfunction? 2mo

BarkingMadRead @Bookwormjillk good eye! I snapped it trying to open the wrapping and was too lazy to get another one 🤣 2mo

Bookwormjillk @BarkingMadRead 🤣🤣 2mo

53 likes1 stack add3 comments

BarkingMadRead

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

Hey #sundaybuddyread gang! I‘m reading Taste by Stanley Tucci and he used a Dorothy Parker quote! @TheBookHippie

tpixie 😂 funny quote!!! I love the coinkydink of you reading 2 books with a quote from the same person!!!! The stars align! 🌟 2mo

43 likes1 comment

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

https://classic.esquire.com/article/share/3189e551-05f0-4dac-983c-902558a09682

May have to use reader view ♥️

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

IndoorDame Fascinating! Thanks! 2mo

plemmdog i am always amazed and impressed she left het entire state to MLK. 2mo

TheBookHippie @plemmdog Yes. NCAAP gets her royalties to this day. 2mo

51 likes3 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

I personally know too much of Dorothy to not see the timeline changes, people left out of the story, I‘m not sure this is her- rolling with it. And I‘m enjoying it. I cannot imagine being a woman in the 1920s and I hope we don‘t go all the way back there.

Happy Sunday All!

*If this day is awful for you I‘m sending so much love and a big hug. If you love this day I hope you enjoy it. If it‘s complicated I get it (I hate it.)

Librarybelle My knowledge is limited to Dorothy Parker and her group, so thank you for sharing there are gaps and people missing! I like that historical fiction can introduce you to a topic or a person and then act as a springboard to research more information. 2mo

IndoorDame This isn‘t really my image of Dorothy Parker either, but I know less about her than you so it‘s easy to roll with the book, and I‘m totally enjoying the story for what it is. Turning all the way back to the 20s is a terrifying thought! Thanks for that image 🤣 and I‘m sorry you hate this day, sending love ♥️ 2mo

Sargar114 I‘m surprised there wasn‘t a discussion about the suicide scene. It felt incredibly irresponsible for the author to be as graphic as she was. I know nothing about Dorothy Parker so this was surprising, but more so just because of the level of detail. I‘m taking this with a grain of salt. It doesn‘t seem like the author paints her in a very flattering light though compared to her friends. 2mo

See All 22 Comments

IndoorDame @Sargar114 I totally agree that so far the author isn‘t painting Dottie in a particular flattering light compared to the others, which I was really surprised by, and I‘m extremely curious to see if that changes by the end of the book. But I actually didn‘t find the scene with her suicide attempt at all graphic, so maybe it just depends on your background and perspective. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 I thought it was highly irresponsible as I posted earlier in the week. As I‘m grieving someone who just took their life I just didn‘t have the energy for it today. It is problematic to write of it the way she did. 2mo

IndoorDame @TheBookHippie 🤍🤍🤍🤍 2mo

Sargar114 @TheBookHippie I‘m so sorry to hear that. Hugs lady ❤️❤️❤️ 2mo

vlwelser I hope you have a lovely and relaxing day. Try not to think about this book too hard today if it's not bringing you joy. 2mo

AmyG @TheBookHippie I am so very sorry for your loss. 2mo

AmyG As for Dottie….I know nothing about her life so like @IndoorDame it‘s easy for me to go with the flow. Again, I think (according to the book) she is an alcoholic and has some mental health issues (obviously) that pushed her to attempted suicide. She needs real help which I am not sure she will get being it‘s the 1920‘s. 2mo

AmyG I am also….really enjoying this book alot more than I thought. 2mo

mcctrish I feel like this book travels at light speed, it reads so fast for me. The subject matter is very heavy and while I know some of DP‘s famous lines I thought her life was much easier than this besides the usual woman in a man‘s world shit. I‘m not not liking the ease of this read but it‘s a disservice to the heaviness of the topics. 2mo

mcctrish Christine I am so sorry for your loss 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish it does read quickly. I keep reminding myself if someone followed me 7-28 I wouldn‘t read much differently -although I abhor drinking to this access and was more fiercely independent than Dottie. I have quite a bit of compassion for all of them. Trauma is just hard. I‘m with @AmyG in 1920s not much help for any type of mental health, outside of institution. 😵‍💫 2mo

IndoorDame @TheBookHippie it‘s odd how much of a NY upper class/Intelligencia thing that kind of drinking is. I naturally gave it up when I left NY because it‘s essentially social drinking, but if I go back for a weekend I definitely drink more 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame I agree. It‘s definitely a thing. 2mo

slategreyskies Just a quick note to say that I‘m still following along, but I didn‘t really have much I wanted to say about today‘s reading. Mother‘s Day is a tough day for me, and I didn‘t want to touch the topic of suicide with a ten foot pole, so I‘m just gonna coast on past it and hope to contribute more in next week‘s discussion. 🤍 2mo

TheBookHippie @slategreyskies I hear you. I hate this day. I just try to get through it. And I‘m coasting this week. Fair warning IRL Dorothy attempts twice. Shouldn‘t be in this timeline but the author isn‘t really following one closely. 2mo

Karisa @slategreyskies @TheBookHippie 🤍🤍🤍 2mo

mollyrotondo I don‘t like that this focuses so much on Dottie‘s weaknesses. I love Jane‘s storyline with her work as a reporter and I love Winifred‘s storyline with her acting career and the monster stalking her. I wish Dottie‘s story focused more on her writing. Peggy feels like she has no story. 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo I agree! I don‘t think she likes her😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫. 2mo

mollyrotondo @TheBookHippie I am so sorry to for the loss of your loved one❤️ 2mo

14 likes22 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Peggy should she have called Dotties husband?👀

Also Poor Dottie
Get it together girl
Ask for HELP

https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20170605-dorothy-parkers-stunning-wit-and-tr...

“I wish I could have met her, just once, held her hand and whispered, “I understand.”
https://www.jpost.com/j-spot/article-707770

IndoorDame I felt super weird about Peggy calling her husband! It seems like overstepping in a major way. Also he was awful! And opening that door again is almost guaranteed to backfire. 2mo

Librarybelle Totally agree, @IndoorDame ! I was not a fan of her calling Dottie‘s husband. I think that was overstepping. 2mo

Sargar114 This was so weird!!! This is where Peggy took a step down in my opinion. A terrible husband is NOT better than no husband. Dottie needs to learn how to live on her own. 2mo

See All 18 Comments

vlwelser I think Peggy was desperate and didn't have any better ideas about keeping her friend safe. She may have just thought he would send more money. 2mo

AmyG I felt Peggy overstepped a bit but I also felt SHE felt she was helping. Dottie is one hot mess. She is lucky she has such devoted friends. 2mo

mcctrish Dottie couldn‘t be left alone. Neysa was away so the easiest of quick check ins was off the table, moving to Jane‘s house should have been insisted on - not only the animals. But Dottie refused, so what‘s left ? There are 2 men responsible for Dotties mental duress and one of them needs to stand up. Just take care of her for a month or 2 (edited) 2mo

mcctrish @Sargar114 she does need to learn to live on her own 2mo

Sargar114 @AmyG agree that Dottie does have wonderful friends. She is incredibly lucky and I like seeing them all step up for her in different ways (even if I don‘t agree with how). I also like that they step up regardless of their personal beliefs, but because a friend needs them. Love women helping women! 2mo

Sargar114 Especially cause the men in this particular subgroup are terrible 2mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 So terrible. 😵‍💫 2mo

AmyG @Sargar114 I agree, the men are awful. Reminds me of the men in The Golden Notebook. 🤣 2mo

TheBookHippie @AmyG 🤣😵‍💫🤣 2mo

kspenmoll @Sargar114 I so agree- Dottie seems like a dependent child. I keep thinking was she really like this ?! (edited) 2mo

Karisa @mcctrish That‘s what I think it came down to too. Peggy just realized that Dottie was not safe and needed help. I didn‘t think he would come back either @IndoorDame I thought at the most he‘d just send more money. It was like he was just waiting for that call (probably thought it would come from Dottie though) 2mo

mollyrotondo I thought Peggy was overstepping but I also understand that she wanted to help her friend and Neysa wasn‘t going to be around. Just feel like calling in the men isn‘t necessarily the best idea 2mo

BarkingMadRead This shocked me. He left her. Why would calling him fix anything? This has to be temporary, I can‘t imagine him sticking around for long! 2mo

julieclair @BarkingMadRead Agreed. And I was also shocked by his reaction. He started sobbing? What? After all he had done to her? 2mo

Read4life @BarkingMadRead & @julieclair I agree. It definitely wasn‘t the reaction I expected. 2mo

11 likes18 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Janes huge party 👀
Interesting food choices ?

Helen Hayes https://www.kennedy-center.org/artists/h/ha-hn/helen-hayes/

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Helen-Hayes

Edna Ferber http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/20419

https://www.pbs.org/video/the-works-of-edna-ferber-gwkvku/

http://jwa.org/encyclopedia/article/ferber-edna

Librarybelle Sounded like a huge celebration, but wasn‘t it also the food that Alec wanted to see??? 2mo

IndoorDame @Librarybelle I think it was all the food he wanted. At some point she‘s gonna figure out that pandering to him doesn‘t work and save her energy for something more fun, right? 2mo

Librarybelle I hope so, @IndoorDame ! 2mo

See All 15 Comments

vlwelser Chinese food would have been amazing. I hate that Alec makes all the choices but makes no contributions. 2mo

AmyG Alec is a bossy, arrogant known-it-all. Iam surprised Jane puts up with him. 2mo

mcctrish Jane is trying to kill Alec with kindness but he just thinks it‘s his due. He can buy his own house and plan all his own fucking parties. @vlwelser I thought Chinese food sounded amazing too !! Alec doesn‘t have to do any work ever, he makes my blood boil 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser @IndoorDame @vlwelser @AmyG @mcctrish not sure the author knows and since most of our characters are Jewish and in NYC https://jewishchronicle.timesofisrael.com/the-secret-history-of-jews-and-chinese... 2mo

IndoorDame @TheBookHippie that‘s awesome! Thanks! We definitely grew up with that attitude towards Chinese food and kashrut in NY, and we always went out for Chinese on Christmas (plus like basically once a week 🤣) but I never knew there was any explanation to the Christmas tradition beyond nothing else was open. 2mo

mcctrish @TheBookHippie I absolutely thought when I read about the Chinese women cooking up the food “this is the beginning of it all!” 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame I love that the Chinese Diner here does the same thing it‘s all us “misfits”. Such a lovely history. 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish YES!! 2mo

kspenmoll It was totally ridiculous that Jane catered to Alex‘s demands that the Chinese chiefs cook traditional ( in his white male mindset) dishes he wanted to eat. Thanks for the article about Chinese food/Jews. (edited) 2mo

Karisa It reminded me of the Dreaming of a Jewish Christmas documentary on PBS https://pbs.org/video/dreaming-of-a-jewish-christmas-vk2hD9?source=social 2mo

mollyrotondo Alec is awful and I don‘t know why Jane still thinks she can pander to him and that will keep him happy. So far nothing keeps him from being an ass 2mo

julieclair Great links! I was delighted to see Helen Hayes appear in the book… all I could think was that one day she‘d have a theater named after her. And the Jewish tradition of Chinese food on Christmas - like @IndoorDame , I always thought it was just because those were the only open restaurants. 2mo

14 likes15 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Christmas
Peggy takes Dottie home.
Oy the phone call
Peggy is very kind about being a fool in love…

IndoorDame Sometime around this phone call she‘s starting to veer off towards too naive for me to find believable. For a while that kind of infatuation really is all consuming. But it‘s been months, and all her friends have told her what she should expect, and she got pregnant and he didn‘t care… someone doesn‘t need to actually tell you they‘re never leaving their partner, and/or they‘re never going to stay with you for you to know that. 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame Exactly. 2mo

Librarybelle The phone call made me shudder. I like your point about Dottie seeming to be a bit naive at this point, @IndoorDame . 2mo

See All 14 Comments

Sargar114 It‘s hard to see things you don‘t want to see. The phone call was so cringe 😵‍💫 2mo

vlwelser Dottie is coming across as a fool. But we all do stupid things sometimes 2mo

AmyG Dottie is a self-posessed fool. Honestly, I don‘t like her at all. She is desperate and just makes bad, bad choices. I also think she may be an alcoholic. 2mo

mcctrish @AmyG I am with you on this. While I totally understand her broken family life has made her crave a family/love for her own AND that the heart wants what the heart wants, she is living in NYC a semi non-traditional lifestyle for a woman of that age/era. She needs to pick a lane. They also ( the 4 women - 5 if we include Neysa) need to talk more amongst themselves. Dottie is a train wreck and you don‘t fix that yourself 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish Right?! They need to talk TOEACHOTHER 😵‍💫 2mo

kspenmoll Dottie is a “train wreck”, seems totally self absorbed, drinks too much, etc. 2mo

Karisa Yeah, I was so glad her friends were stepping in to help care for Dottie, but she just couldn‘t seem to leave it alone. Neysa spelled it out for her early on but Dottie could not hear it. As the book mentions, Parker was full of contradictions but @vlwelser says maybe it just makes her depiction more true to life in this part. 2mo

mollyrotondo @IndoorDame agree with you completely. I mean we all act foolishly sometimes but this was just so self destructive. To call him? When he left you to be with his WIFE on Christmas? Such major reasons to let him go. I also find it interesting how much marriage seemed to be a loose committed amongst so many. It just seems like a lot of people in this group found it normal to be married and to have other relationships instead of labeling it cheating 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo As divorce wasn‘t really an option or legal really and many marriages still “arranged” affairs were “normal” in this time frame …Reports in the 1920s indicated that 28% of American men and 24% of women were adulterous at some point after wedding. I‘m thinking it was higher. 😵‍💫👀 2mo

BarkingMadRead Ugh how can someone so smart make such poor choices!! 2mo

julieclair Dottie is totally consumed by insecurity. It‘s so hard to watch the poor choices she makes as a result. She is a train wreck for sure. 2mo

13 likes14 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Winifred
I rather like her
She takes good care of Dottie too
I love her street smarts
But the gangster… yikes

I hope we get more of her story…
Although IRL I‘ve not found much on her.

IndoorDame I really like her too! The explanation for why she knew where to go for a therapeutic abortion was unbearably sad. I also thought it was interesting that the author made a point of including details to show us that there really had been a friend before, and she wasn‘t talking about herself euphemistically. Like as readers we couldn‘t handle thinking of her being used in that way, even though we already know there‘s some unnamed abuse in her past. 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame Yes the underlying subtle not subtle feelings of the author are pushing through or the author is incredibly sheltered or ignorant or religious? 😵‍💫🤣🤷🏻‍♀️ or all three😱 (edited) 2mo

Librarybelle I‘m curious how the storyline with Winifred and the monster will progress. I feel something is going to happen - you cannot keep saying no to a monster without some sort of repercussions. 2mo

See All 15 Comments

Sargar114 @IndoorDame that‘s an interesting point, I didn‘t even think that it could have been Winifred. Probably me being oblivious, but can totally see that. I do wonder what will happen with her and the mobster. Did he find out about her because of Jane? 2mo

vlwelser She's fierce and a good friend. I'm concerned about the gangster business 2mo

AmyG Yes, I wonder where the gangster “stuff” plays into the story with Jane and Winifred. I like her but it seems she had some sort of abuse (?) in her past…maybe we find out. 2mo

mcctrish @Librarybelle I‘m quite apprehensive about that story line. I really like Winnifred, she‘s got good clear boundaries now which she put up obviously thx to something awful happening. I think the 4 girls need to talk/share and learn from each other 2mo

Librarybelle @mcctrish Yes…I agree. 2mo

kspenmoll I like her too, her compassion,boundaries. 2mo

Karisa The gangster with the flowers every show and not taking no for an answer is so creepy. It reminds me of a biography I read about Hedy Lamarr‘s that included the story of her Nazi munitions business husband. He also kept flooding her with flowers and stalking. Controlling and frightening 2mo

mollyrotondo @Karisa I read the fictional book about Hedy Lamarr and was very shocked that was her backstory. So happy she was able to get away and come to the U.S. 2mo

mollyrotondo I also like Winifred a lot. I also find her storyline really intriguing. I hope nothing terrible happens to her with this gangster. It‘s interesting because actresses are still targets of stalkers today. It‘s not safe always being in the spotlight. And issue that I don‘t think gets seriously addressed. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa YES!! Exactly. Scary controlling. 2mo

BarkingMadRead Love Winifred, super stressed about the gangster, they don‘t like the word no! 2mo

julieclair I give Winifred so much credit for turning the mobster down as many times as she has. But she can‘t keep doing that forever. And the mobster obviously won‘t take “no” for an answer. Very worrisome. 2mo

13 likes15 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Jane interviewing the mob
I love it
She‘s very brave
And her case MYSTERIOUSLY disappears…

Not sure what to think of her marriage.
But I like her attitude. 🙃

IndoorDame I was so impressed! It takes something special to charm a mob boss, but it takes something really special to charm one of those guys when 20 minutes ago you were scared to walk into a room and talk to them. And I know her character says she doesn‘t want to owe anything to him, but the woman she‘s based on becomes a player in the NY world, and in those days that didn‘t really happen without at least the mob‘s blessing if not their support. 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame I had the same thoughts about the mob. No way you‘re running a paper either. 2mo

Librarybelle I think this shows Jane‘s bravery. Good thoughts on the mob and the paper, @IndoorDame @TheBookHippie ! I would not be surprised… 2mo

See All 16 Comments

Sargar114 Agreed she‘s incredibly tough. This was a no win scenario and she made the best of it. She‘s a bit naive to think she can get out of it without the mobs help but maybe that‘s our ability to have all the information. Her marriage with Harold is interesting. Unsure if it‘s based on love or mutual respect or just an image to uphold. 2mo

mcctrish I love Jane. 2mo

vlwelser She's my fav 2mo

AmyG She is an awesome woman…strong, brave, modern. She seems to have a good marriage.i keep waiting for a fight or so ething but they seem solid. 2mo

kspenmoll She is fabulous!!!! 2mo

Karisa I like Jane too. She‘s talented, brave, giving, and hardworking. I‘m waiting for her to kick Alec out! 2mo

mollyrotondo I love Jane! And I love her storyline! It‘s so interesting and she‘s such a strong person! I know in real life she divorces Harold and I can understand if the marriage doesn‘t last in the book either. He‘s not great. He‘s sort of all about himself. I don‘t love him. I think Jane could do without him. 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo I have the exact same knowledge and thoughts! 2mo

BarkingMadRead Not a huge fan of Harold, I‘m not sure why Jane even married him! 2mo

julieclair I admire Jane. I think Harold is not in her league. And it really bothers me that Harold doesn‘t stand up for her against Alec. 2mo

Read4life I keep wondering if Harold doesn‘t support Jane when it comes to Alec because he‘s just doesn‘t care or because Alec has something on him. 2mo

TheBookHippie @BarkingMadRead me either. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Read4life 🤷🏻‍♀️ 2mo

13 likes16 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

TheBookHippie https://longreads.com/2014/04/30/the-odd-couple-alexander-woollcott-and-harpo-ou... 2mo

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Alec
I assumed he hated women
So he apparently wanted Jane
And now wants Neysa
I don‘t see it
I do think he‘s evil.
I would not let him live in my house.
Yikes.
And telling Dotties business at Christmas in a crowd.
He‘s just mean.
I would kick him out so fast.
He makes me uncomfortable
Then he irritates Jane talking about her marriage
Trying to start trouble
Then telling Dottie‘s abortion to her husband
⬇️ Interesting

IndoorDame He‘s so awful! I hate that she‘s living with him! I was totally on board with the theory that he was in love with Harold and lashing out and causing trouble because of that, (still hated him, but also felt somewhat sympathetic)… until he outed Dottie‘s abortion, which I can‘t come up with any personal motive for except he‘s just an unhappy, unpleasant, awful person 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame 💯💯💯💯💯 2mo

See All 23 Comments

Librarybelle Was he this awful in real life? I‘m not as well versed on Alec. Thanks for sharing this link! 2mo

TheBookHippie @Librarybelle Anything I‘ve read alludes to a bitter man. Most gossips say he was closeted and miserable. 2mo

Sargar114 He would have been out of the house the second he outed her abortion!!! I suppose Jane wasn‘t privy to that info at that time, but as soon as it was confirmed how can you continue to associate with someone willing to do something like that!!! He is a terrible human being!!!! 2mo

Librarybelle Good to know, @TheBookHippie ! 2mo

mcctrish @Sargar114 he‘d have been out of the house as soon as he threw Jane to the prohibition police! And then out of the Gonk too! Harold is on the wrong side of this ( truthfully I wondered if he wasn‘t gay too and it‘s all a front for them and Jane is collateral ) 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish BRILLIANT this is perfect sense!!! 2mo

AmyG My thoughts were he is gay. And what a horrid, angry, jealous man. @TheBookHippie YES…a bitter, closeted, miserable gay man. If he was unhappy…he was going to make everyone else unhappy, too. (edited) 2mo

Sargar114 @mcctrish ahhhh good point!!! 2mo

vlwelser He seems closeted and bitter about it. I don't understand why they keep him around. I suppose this is a setback to writing about real people. You can't just ditch them out of the story when they annoy you. 2mo

IndoorDame @vlwelser 😂😂😂😂😂😂 2mo

IndoorDame @mcctrish that never occurred to me! But it makes the whole setup start to make way more sense!!!! 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser can we make this a thing… “I‘m sorry I‘ve written you out of the story” so using this IRL 🤣🤣🤣🤣 2mo

mcctrish @TheBookHippie @vlwelser PERFECT!!!! 2mo

kspenmoll @IndoorDame Totally yes to all that! Despicable, mean, bitter- & letting Jane take the rap for the raid on her house- just yuk. I too thought he was closeted & Jane was right in her thinking he loved Harold & hated that they were married. 2mo

Karisa To have him in the house would be the worst. It‘s one thing to have a person you can‘t always avoid when out and about or at work, quite another to have them live with you. Even dictating the holiday menu! Petty! He stores up sensitive info like ammunition. How does he still have so many friends??? 2mo

mollyrotondo I had also thought that he was in love with Harold lol it makes more sense to me because he always seems to try to hurt Jane. He never tries to hurt Harold or put ideas in Harold‘s head. I do hate this character but he makes for a great antagonist in a book lol but I agree with @Karisa he stores up people‘s personal info as ammunition to use later when he gets mad at them 2mo

Karisa @mollyrotondo Just imagine what he would‘ve done with social media! 😱 2mo

mollyrotondo @Karisa oh my gosh he would be the type to ruin people through social media. See times don‘t change, just the technology 🤦🏻‍♀️ 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa OH MY WORD. He would have been one of those types that leak everyone‘s secrets!!! 2mo

BarkingMadRead Alec is a nightmare, I don‘t understand why they keep him around! 2mo

12 likes23 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Dottie
Everyone trying to warn her
Neysa especially
Pregnancy/Abortion
Love starved open wound
Think this is an accurate portrayal of Dorothy
Winifred to the rescue
Lenox Hospital
Peggy tells Charlie off
And makes him visit Dottie
Then he comes back again
With an ugly scarf
What a tool

🤍I do not think the descriptions needed to be that vivid. It felt like an agenda. Abortion is personal, it has also saved my life, twice.

IndoorDame So agree about the abortion portal!!! I know too many women who genuinely believe you cannot have an abortion without it being a fraught decision that haunts you for the rest of your life, and portrayals like this really contribute to that perception. 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame I agree. Made me so mad. 😵‍💫 2mo

Librarybelle Good riddance to Charlie. This was an emotionally charged passage, and I was surprised by the details shared by the author, especially during the procedure. 2mo

See All 42 Comments

Sargar114 I appreciated having Dotties‘s perspective during this scene. Having never been through this experience, I‘ve always presumed it wasn‘t pleasant or easy. I didn‘t think of it as problematic, but maybe that‘s because I‘m a woman and realize the complexity in a decision like that or have had the “what would I do in that situation?” thought. Definitely gives me something to think about. 2mo

Sargar114 @Librarybelle I was surprised as well and it seemed excessive, but I guess we‘re discussing it so maybe that was the point. 🤷🏼‍♀️ 2mo

Librarybelle Maybe, @Sargar114 🤷🏻‍♀️ 2mo

TheBookHippie @Librarybelle I‘ve been through the procedure twice -once though I was put under for a long time as I was bleeding to death from a ruptured ectopic pregnancy. But the other time I was further along than this (the baby had already passed and wouldn‘t let go) and the procedure was quick and I recovered in a few days. Bleeding a few weeks normal, 2007 different than 1920 but not by much. @Sargar114 🤷🏻‍♀️ I always think of this ⬇️ 2mo

TheBookHippie ⬆️ Doctors considered midwives, who attended births and performed abortions as part of their regular practice, a threat to their own economic and social power. The medical establishment actively took up the antiabortion cause in the second half of the 19th century as part of its effort to eliminate midwives. 2mo

mcctrish @TheBookHippie both of your experiences sound so scary and heartbreaking 2mo

Librarybelle @TheBookHippie ❤️❤️❤️ 2mo

mcctrish This part reminded me of the book “Looking For Jane” but that is set several decades closer to our time now. I‘m still amazed the hospital did the abortion- only in New York City I‘d bet 💔 but still the doctor is male and somehow it‘s always the woman‘s fault #ittakestwototango 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish I think abortion is healthcare -no matter how you use it. If I lived in any of the states here in the US that ban it I‘d be dead. It‘s infuriating. But yes, it was scary. Broke my heart, but it‘s mended. Grateful to the nurses who saved me. Who were actually nurses who shadowed me at my job when I was nursing, so they listened. The doctor in ER did not. My doctor was called in to save me. ER doc didn‘t believe in abortion. 😵‍💫 2mo

IndoorDame @TheBookHippie I‘m so glad you were able to get safe skillful abortions, since those don‘t sound like easy, routine procedures. I hope access to that continues for women 🙏 2mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish A lot of abortions were scheduled as DNC and performed at so many city hospitals but even here an hour away they did -but get this in the basement of the hospital!!! We learned this during nurses training. Blew my mind. 2mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame Me too. Scary times. 2mo

AmyG I found this part fascinating…that you could walk into a hospital and complain about the “stress” of it all….and be offered an abortion. But I also think…only in NY. There was alot of money there and alot of men who got women “in trouble” so I wasn‘t surprised. As for having it be a difficult decision? There are all kinds of people, with all kind of mental states…it doesn‘t surprise me that there are people who just want it over with. (edited) 2mo

AmyG Dottie seems very self-possessed. I had no clue about her at all. And @TheBookHippie I am sorry you had to go through with those. Abortion IS health care. In the Jewish religion the life of the mother is most important. Oh please, don‘t get me started. 2mo

vlwelser I didn't like how nonchalant they seemed about the whole thing. And then the doctor scolds her about lying. And the whole thing is about lying to even get one. This seemed a little crazy to me. 2mo

vlwelser I am glad you are safe and healthy. 2mo

Sargar114 @vlwelser the lying part AND the scolding felt the most realistic. I imagine that still has to happen today sadly. Agree that abortion is healthcare and it‘s terrible that women and girls don‘t have access to that. I swear if he made viagra illegal cities would burn! 2mo

vlwelser @Sargar114 sadly the old white men are still in charge. So Viagra stays. 2mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser the whole lying thing is demeaning to the women and I think on purpose. Last I checked men can make women pregnant every time they ejaculate. 👀🤣🤷🏻‍♀️🤭 They shoulder none of it. 🤬 2mo

mcctrish Abortion is absolutely health care! 2mo

AmyG @TheBookHippie To shoulder any of it would mean loss of control, power. 2mo

TheBookHippie @AmyG Exactly why they ban it. It‘s a war on women. And the degree these men hate women.. whew. Unreal. 2mo

kspenmoll This is so relevant today, sadly to say. I am so naive; I never thought I‘d see the day when basic healthcare rights would be taken away after Roe v. Wade. I got pregnant when I was 17 & for various reasons did not want to have the baby. As my friend said “you found yourself a nice Jewish doctor to set it up in NYC” where it was legal, unlike CT. I was lucky- I was working part time so I had $, my boyfriend was responsible- contributing to the🔽 2mo

kspenmoll 🔼 cost, going on the train to The City with me, & the clinic, etc. when I went for my annual Gyn appt 6 months later when i turned 18, my doctor told me how concerned he had bern due to my being underage. At the time He had tried to talk me into telling my dad, a fellow physician whom he knew, but both my parents were devout Catholics- so No! I am forever grateful to my then Gyn. 2mo

TheBookHippie @kspenmoll ♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️ 2mo

julieclair I know nothing about this author, but I do feel the level of detail was unnecessary and designed to provoke. Abortion is a totally personal decision, and different for every woman, based on their circumstances, their faith, family situation, their health, etc. @TheBookHippie I‘m thankful you were not denied a medical procedure that saved your life twice. And @kspenmoll I‘m so glad you were able to choose the healthcare that was right for you. 💙 2mo

julieclair This portrait is so revealing. Dottie looks sad, vulnerable, fragile and a bit lost. 2mo

Karisa This was a tough section to read with so much judgement heaped on Dottie. It felt like even some of her friends were blaming her for Charlie being such a jerk and having to go through it all. What a tough decision! I also found myself wondering how true to Parker‘s experience it actually was. 2mo

Karisa @kspenmoll @TheBookHippie Glad you both had access to the care you needed. Can‘t believe that abortion access is being questioned by so many today. 2mo

mollyrotondo Abortion is HEALTH CARE!!! 2mo

mollyrotondo @TheBookHippie so happy you were saved by responsible doctors. @kspenmoll so glad you were able to make your own healthcare decision and had a doctor you could trust. Thank you both for sharing your personal experiences ❤️ 2mo

mollyrotondo I was also getting a little twitchy about how this author was handling Dottie‘s situation. I wasn‘t sure if I was reading too much into the comments about the regret and the guilt Winifred was feeling bringing Dottie and “pushing” her and the more horror movie descriptions of the procedure. But if others here also felt like the author was portraying it in a conservative leaning way then it makes me a little leery of this author 😬 2mo

mollyrotondo I hated that Peggy insisted Charlie come see Dottie. I actually thought it was the worst thing for Dottie. He‘s a complete jerk and I don‘t think Dottie‘s friend should be trying to convince a guy that is bad to her to try to work things out with her. It bothered me. I love the love of the friends in this book but this was a friend misstep in my opinion. 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo I know!!! I‘m LEARY!! 😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫😵‍💫 2mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo I think the women should have cared for her. Taken shifts. Not the idiot married dude. 2mo

TheBookHippie @Karisa People have thrown their own feelings into it when writing about it. However anytime Dorothy spoke it was just the multilayered thing that it is. After this event is when she really became political, outspoken, pushing for social justice. Could it be because she was treated horrifically, shamed and victimised by a doctor and the fact that it was all illegal? She did not want to be shamed and silenced so she spoke up and out. 2mo

Karisa @TheBookHippie She was such an amazing person. I hope that the book shows that side of her as well. So far Dottie is not the strongest character in the book. I feel like I need to read more of her essays—Jane‘s too. 2mo

Karisa @mollyrotondo Agreed! The author seems to be interjecting a bit too much. At the least trying to placate any right-leaning readers. 😕 Also, I agree that Charlie should have just exited the building if he wasn‘t going to really be there. It was false hope. Peggy (if she did all this) is such a product of those times running to the men to “fix” Dottie instead of helping her feel more empowered. 🥴 2mo

mollyrotondo @Karisa 💯💯💯💯 you put it perfectly! Peggy is a big product of her time. I hope she grows too by the end of this book. And Charlie was done with Dottie and he should have stayed gone. 2mo

13 likes42 comments

mcctrish

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

Speakeasy vibes for #sundaybuddyread #iykyk that‘s a delightful pink gin fizz in my tea cup, I‘m channeling Jane and her tasty bathtub gin

Tamra I‘ve never had a pink smashed gin, but I want to try it! 💓 (edited) 3mo

mcctrish @Tamra it‘s delicious 3mo

tpixie Oh my! I love gin! I want some. Your cup is delightful! What a great way to enjoy yourself! 3mo

See All 8 Comments

tpixie Is the gin pink? Or is that pink lemonade? 3mo

mcctrish @tpixie it‘s a pink gin fizz : gin, sparkling water, lemon and raspberry and absolutely delicious 3mo

kspenmoll That delicious drink in a teacup sounds splendid! 3mo

tpixie @mcctrish thx!! 3mo

TheBookHippie Love it!!! 2mo

49 likes2 stack adds8 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Sorry folks, although I know Dorothy‘s real life I wasn‘t sure what we would read. Or what the author would write. I should have alerted triggers.

988 https://988lifeline.org/

As with any author I‘m sure her opinions have seeped in. Not every detail of real life is always shared is a good reminder. This is fiction many people and facts aren‘t told here is a good reminder. The author chose what to share.

Til Sunday 🤐🤐🤫

Sargar114 The author was quite graphic (regardless of fact or fiction), that‘s not on you 😘 3mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 purposeful for her point of view on the subject matter I think 😵‍💫🤐OY. Unnecessary. 3mo

Read4life I agree, @Sargar114 . Definitely not on you, @TheBookHippie 💙 3mo

Librarybelle I‘m reading this week‘s section soon, so even before reading it, I know this is not on you. Discussion facilitators don‘t always know where or how the story goes. ❤️ 3mo

43 likes4 comments

Sargar114

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This week‘s section of #sundaybuddyread was INTENSE! Pretty graphic triggers but I‘m sure will make for quite the discussion. I‘m still wrapping my head around it 🤐

AmyG Oh man, Dottie. 😳 3mo

Read4life Well said. 😳🤔 3mo

14 likes2 comments

BarkingMadRead

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

I love when a storm rolls in, I‘m porch sitting until the rain starts. It always seems to soak the porch immediately 🙄 I would love to sit out here in the rain!

IndoorDame The light is spectacular! Thank you for sharing the photo! I wish you could stay out there! 3mo

TheBookgeekFrau Oh good, I'm not the only one with a covered porch that doesn't stay dry 😅😆 3mo

BarkingMadRead @TheBookgeekFrau so frustrating!! As soon as the rain starts, it gets soaked! 3mo

Cathythoughts Looks lovely where you are. ❤️ 3mo

BarkingMadRead @Cathythoughts our neighborhood is really nice, and with all the rain, it‘s also very green! 3mo

48 likes5 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

That‘s a wrap on #WickedWords for May.

AsYouWish

AsYouWish Yay!!! Good job!!!!💙💙💙💙 2mo

45 likes1 comment

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#WickedWords #Shakespeare
Word 5/5

@AsYouWish

Reading this one for #SUNDAYBUDDYREAD
@TheBookHippie

44 likes

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

#WickedWords #poem
Word 4/5

@AsYouWish

41 likes

Karisa

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

Wow! Learned this from #SundayBuddyRead video link from @TheBookHippie today. I didn‘t realize just how cool Dorothy Parker was before! https://youtu.be/ud3-3-SPW-A?si=xHDMJ_2FUWfJiF8F

Jas16 I had no idea. Love her even more now. 3mo

Karisa @Jas16 I know right?! 🥰 3mo

Sargar114 So cool! 3mo

49 likes3 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

I was link happy
Here‘s another https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ud3-3-SPW-A

I think we‘re going to have a fun ride! 👀

Happy Sunday 🤍

📖 https://ia802902.us.archive.org/16/items/in.ernet.dli.2015.184951/2015.184951.Th...

Librarybelle This is a fun story! 3mo

mcctrish Love the links and I‘m going to learn so much 3mo

Karisa So much to dig into here! What a fun read. 😊 Did not picture the Algonquin that way! Fancy! (edited) 3mo

See All 14 Comments

IndoorDame I didn‘t know The Algonquin had a hotel 🐈!!!! 3mo

TheBookHippie @IndoorDame yes you can visit him. 3mo

AmyG Good choice! I am enjoying this one. 3mo

vlwelser I love it so far. Glad your birthday month book is turning out this good. 3mo

TheBookHippie @vlwelser 😅😅😅😅WHEW… 3mo

kspenmoll I am loving this book! 3mo

DebinHawaii Looks like a fun video—I‘ll go back & watch more of it later. Enjoying this one so far & looking forward to where it goes. 🤗 3mo

slategreyskies This is a really enjoyable book so far! I flew through today‘s section, and I‘m looking forward to next week‘s discussion! 🤍 3mo

julieclair Loving this books and loving the links! 👍😘 3mo

mollyrotondo Definitely enjoying the book so far! 3mo

TheBookHippie @mollyrotondo I am too!!! Whew!!! 3mo

20 likes14 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers

#SUNDAYBUDDYREAD

Dotties marriage
Dottie husband not same since the war
Yikes
Her eye 😵‍💫
Dottie & Winfred head out together
Dotties husband leaves she finds a playmate 🤭
Her friends are worried about her rose colored glasses and new playmate…

Winifred
Poor thing PTSD
RUN RUN RUN GIRL

Our story is set!!!! WHEW!

Librarybelle So much happening! I feel sad for Dottie regarding her marriage. 3mo

mcctrish I do feel bad for Dottie in terms of her marriage although they barely knew each other and hadn‘t been married long before Eddie went to war. She seems pretty caustic to me, her witticisms seem like barbs most of the time and her humour the kind where you say something mean and call it a joke ie someone is always the butt of it. Eddie‘s accidental/on purpose punch was brutal as was his non-acknowledgement of it. 3mo

mcctrish Dottie‘s latching on to Charlie seems desperate. She needs a man? She does nothing traditional around the house/home? She feels like a train wreck 3mo

See All 24 Comments

Karisa @mcctrish Yes! The new boyfriend thing was just so fast. She‘s using him to bolster her own self confidence after Eddie maybe? I don‘t trust Charlie yet though 3mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish I think she liked sex, 🤭😅 and I‘ve always thought if it were a man behaving like this and writing like she did no one would say a word. @Karisa (edited) 3mo

mcctrish @TheBookHippie it‘s more than liking sex (Neysa likes sex ) and if Dottie needs more than sex that‘s cool too. But she needs to figure her shit out first 3mo

mcctrish @Karisa me either. He just wants to have sex but he‘s wrapping it up in a prettier package and Dottie is dropping everything to run home 3mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish I agree she‘s a hot mess express. 3mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish youth oy.. lessons to be learned. 3mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish Neysa is so cool. 3mo

mcctrish Maybe that‘s my problem, maybe I‘m comparing Dottie to all the other women 3mo

TheBookHippie @mcctrish 🙃 3mo

IndoorDame Love that Dottie does what she wants and is unapologetic! But right now she‘s lying to herself a bit about Eddie and about the new man. Not sure if that‘s the author‘s vision, or the time in her life, but I hope either way she gets stronger and her inner life actually matches her caustic barbs. 3mo

mcctrish @IndoorDame I do love that too - Dottie being Dottie - but she needs to sit with herself but the links show why being alone is not something she wants to do ☹️ 3mo

AmyG I think it wasn‘t uncommon during that time period….men going off to war and coming back changed. In that I feel bad for Dottie. Butshe seems to make poor choices in her personal life. Makes her human. 3mo

vlwelser That was a lot of action for the beginning of any book. I hope it keeps this pace. 3mo

kspenmoll She is a hot mess. I was naively shocked that she was so dependent on her husband- smart women who knew nothing about bills, etc. sad. 3mo

Sargar114 I think her friends were right to be concerned about Dottie and the fling with Charlie. She‘s still recovering from her marriage and the abuse, she wasn‘t even able to admit that Eddie hit her to her friends which is how you know that she even knew it was wrong. And she was in such denial about the abuse that she was devastated when he left. I also think she sees herself as a “kept” woman so always has to have someone to take care of her. 3mo

TheBookHippie @Sargar114 I think her being in a childhood that was fraught with people leaving probably didn‘t help. No one ever took care of her as a child she‘s still searching for it 🤷🏻‍♀️ It‘s sad no matter what her underlying reason. 3mo

DebinHawaii Definitely a hot mess. I am good with her sowing some oats with Eddie being such a jerk & the abuse but it does seem like she is falling for Charlie too quick. She needs to get herself settled before jumping into something new. 3mo

slategreyskies I think it‘s awful that Eddie came back from the war with what sounds like a fierce case of PTSD. I know someone that happened to, actually more than one someone, and they each handled it in their own way, but for both of them, heavy alcohol use was their drug of choice. However, it seemed to me to go beyond that in Eddie‘s case. I don‘t think they were a good fit, and I‘m glad he left. I do think Charlie is not a good choice, but ⬇️ 3mo

slategreyskies (Cont.) when we‘re hurting or life shakes us up, I know a lot of people reach for the quick feel good choice rather than the smart one. 3mo

julieclair @slategreyskies Excellent point about her reaching for the quick feel good choice. I sure do hope Charlie doesn‘t end up damaging her even more. 3mo

mollyrotondo Eddie has severe PTSD but that doesn't mean Dottie has to put up with his abuse. When he hit her so badly her eye was swollen for days he didn't even notice he hurt her. That's how drunk he was. He needs help and Dottie should have been the one to walk away. But instead she clung to him until he dumped her basically because he wanted a stay at home wife (see not a good marriage regardless of the drinking and PTSD) and clinging to a new man. 3mo

16 likes24 comments

The Manhattan Girls | Gill Paul

This post contains spoilers